1/6 Hot Toys - Venom: Let There Be Carnage - Carnage Collectible Figure

[faker]

Again nah. Venom is more a villain. But we can do this all day. He still stalked and tried to kill somebody . This was waaay after the mcfarlene run. I dont know what you guys don’t understand about that. Just cause he did a few good things doesn’t mean he’s all good. He’s been trying to kill Spider-Man since the early 2000s. So no not a hero . But to each is own .

You're not bringing any facts, you're just saying he's bad and not giving examples, like saying he's been trying to kill Spidey since 00's but that's a lie. That was mostly only in the 90s, his ex Anne convinces him not to fight spidey because it makes no sense, literally why he goes to California to be a hero, his grudge against Spidey is stupid, and he knows it. They tried to rekindle it in the 00's so he could be his nemesis after Anne kills herself, but it made no sense and they dropped it after 2 issues, outside of a brief stint when he had cancer and a venom shirt he doesn't do much to be evil after that.

Right after, he becomes Anti-Venom and goe around curing heroine addicts of their addictons, before he becomes Toxin and is basically just old Venom again with an uglier costume.

Also killing bad guys isn’t heroic. But again to each is own

Killing bad guys used to be heroic, it's only a recent thing that every hero adopted a "no kill policy" even if the villain in question comes back and murders hundreds, like Joker.

 

[BeefEaster]

I remember when arrow first came out and he just straight up murdered everyone. That was what got me into the show initially.

 

[ironwez20]

You're not bringing any facts, you're just saying he's bad and not giving examples, like saying he's been trying to kill Spidey since 00's but that's a lie. That was mostly only in the 90s, his ex Anne convinces him not to fight spidey because it makes no sense, literally why he goes to California to be a hero, his grudge against Spidey is stupid, and he knows it. They tried to rekindle it in the 00's so he could be his nemesis after Anne kills herself, but it made no sense and they dropped it after 2 issues, outside of a brief stint when he had cancer and a venom shirt he doesn't do much to be evil after that.

Right after, he becomes Anti-Venom and goe around curing heroine addicts of their addictons, before he becomes Toxin and is basically just old Venom again with an uglier costume.


Killing bad guys used to be heroic, it's only a recent thing that every hero adopted a "no kill policy" even if the villain in question comes back and murders hundreds, like Joker.

No you aren’t bringing any facts.Like I said he tried to kill Spider-Man in the 80- 00s but somehow he’s a hero because he did some good things? Then he eats and kills bad guys . Not heroic. If you stalk and try to kill someone im sorry that ain’t heroic. I could care less how the comics changed. He’s still bad. When he went after carnage he wanted to do everything in his power to kill him or anyone that got in his way. Again every spidey villian has gone through a bit of a change or period where they were good. Almost all of them. Still villains at the end of the day. Sandman was a avenger and doc ock was Spider-Man himself. Still classified as his rogues. Just cause they did good things doesn’t excuse them from being villains . Early 00s venom still joined the sinister six. 90s venom still tried to kill spidey. Then they kept bouncing the symbiote back and forth from host to host making the symbiote venom and not brick himself . Really weird . It was a strange run

 

[Fr0stbit3]

No you aren’t bringing any facts.Like I said he tried to kill Spider-Man in the 80- 00s but somehow he’s a hero because he did some good things? Then he eats and kills bad guys . Not heroic. If you stalk and try to kill someone im sorry that ain’t heroic. I could care less how the comics changed. He’s still bad. When he went after carnage he wanted to do everything in his power to kill him or anyone that got in his way. Again every spidey villian has gone through a bit of a change or period where they were good. Almost all of them. Still villains at the end of the day. Sandman was a avenger and doc ock was Spider-Man himself. Still classified as his rogues. Just cause they did good things doesn’t excuse them from being villains . Early 00s venom still joined the sinister six. 90s venom still tried to kill spidey. Then they kept bouncing the symbiote back and forth from host to host making the symbiote venom and not brick himself . Really weird . It was a strange run

How many times do we have to tell you he doesn’t eat people

 

[shadow_wolf]

How can you say Venom is not evil, look at what it did to Peter:

 

[ironwez20]

How many times do we have to tell you he doesn’t eat people

He literally eats his victims? Like he eats the bad guys I showed you a whole list? Are y’all like confused on what a hero and a villain is ? in the damn movie he eats people . But yea he’s def Superman

 

[ironwez20]

 

[faker]

No you aren’t bringing any facts.Like I said he tried to kill Spider-Man in the 80- 00s but somehow he’s a hero because he did some good things?

I literally am citing comic runs and eras of the character, you have done nothing but make things up. Venom also wasn't around much in the 80s considering he debuted as a full character in summer 88.

Then he eats and kills bad guys . Not heroic. If you stalk and try to kill someone im sorry that ain’t heroic.

He doesn't eat bad guys, he did that once or twice, mostly it was a threat, it was no on purpose, which you would know if you read anything on the character. The only person he's ever stalked was Spider-man, and again, he only did that briefly, his intial appearance, the one that came right after which he explicitly didn't kill spiderman and led into maximum carnage later, and the one that l mentioned where Spiderman saves Anne and Venom leaves for CA for lethal protector. That's maybe 30 issues or so of being a "bad guy" he doesn't eat anybody in those issues, he only ever does in the later runs, and i t was not intentional.

I could care less how the comics changed. He’s still bad.

You are saying that if a character changes fundamentally they are always bad, that makes no sense. If that were true Deadpool, Prowler, Rogue, etc would all still be evil. Characters like Magneto wouldn't have arcs, etc.

When he went after carnage he wanted to do everything in his power to kill him or anyone that got in his way.

No, explicitly he only wanted to kill carnage, they get Venom from his tropical island where he planned to stay to get him to help kill carnage because he turning all of new york into a blood bath, he explicitly stops trying to kill spiderman while cat puts aside her hatred of him, to go kill carnage because he's murdering hundreds every day. He never wanted to kill anybody else, he makes a comment about not letting anyone get in his way, but he doesn't act on it. In fact, during his first appearances, he resents killing anyone who isn't spider-man, even if they're in his way.

Again every spidey villian has gone through a bit of a change or period where they were good. Almost all of them. Still villains at the end of the day. Sandman was a avenger and doc ock was Spider-Man himself. Still classified as his rogues.

Sand man was a good guy for a long period of time until editorial stepped in, Venom is a different case because he's not been a villain most of his career, from 93 to 2000 at least, he was only a villain for his early life when he was debuting in the spiderman book. Once he goes to california he doesn't want to kill spiderman anymore until the sinister six book in the early 00s, and shortly after he auctions the suit. Eddie has literally been a hero/anti-hero longer than he was ever a villain unless you only watch SM3 and some of the cartoons.

Just cause they did good things doesn’t excuse them from being villains . Early 00s venom still joined the sinister six.

He didn't, he tried to and the sinister six thought he was too unstable and crazy to use, they might've briefly used him as a diversion to kill spiderman, but with intent to kill him after he was never a part of the official group. Again it was that short run in the 00s that didn't go anywhere, that hardly undoes the hundred or so issue run before that where he was protecting the homeless in LA.

90s venom still tried to kill spidey. Then they kept bouncing the symbiote back and forth from host to host making the symbiote venom and not brick himself . Really weird . It was a strange run

This was because Eddie as an antagonist for Spiderman never made any sense and editorial never addressed it, so because Eddie being a bad guy didn't work the idea was to get a better suited host who actually had a reason to hate spider-man to be Peter's reverse flash. Every time they tried to make Eddie act like a bad guy fans hated it, and people who "liked it" didn't read the book. The result was a bunch of hosts like Gargan or that one mob boss's kid getting the suit, and eventually having it end up on Flash.

 

[faker]

View attachment 557967

He always talks about eating brains and pancreases, he doesn't actually do that until the government run where the suit does it by accident, and without his knowledge.

View attachment 557968

That's ultimate Venom, that is not mainline venom, and the fact that you had to go out of your way to cherry pick a comic page to prove yourself right while you ignore literally all of his history is telling.

 

[ironwez20]

I literally am citing comic runs and eras of the character, you have done nothing but make things up. Venom also wasn't around much in the 80s considering he debuted as a full character in summer 88.

He doesn't eat bad guys, he did that once or twice, mostly it was a threat, it was no on purpose, which you would know if you read anything on the character. The only person he's ever stalked was Spider-man, and again, he only did that briefly, his intial appearance, the one that came right after which he explicitly didn't kill spiderman and led into maximum carnage later, and the one that l mentioned where Spiderman saves Anne and Venom leaves for CA for lethal protector. That's maybe 30 issues or so of being a "bad guy" he doesn't eat anybody in those issues, he only ever does in the later runs, and i t was not intentional.

You are saying that if a character changes fundamentally they are always bad, that makes no sense. If that were true Deadpool, Prowler, Rogue, etc would all still be evil. Characters like Magneto wouldn't have arcs, etc.


No, explicitly he only wanted to kill carnage, they get Venom from his tropical island where he planned to stay to get him to help kill carnage because he turning all of new york into a blood bath, he explicitly stops trying to kill spiderman while cat puts aside her hatred of him, to go kill carnage because he's murdering hundreds every day. He never wanted to kill anybody else, he makes a comment about not letting anyone get in his way, but he doesn't act on it. In fact, during his first appearances, he resents killing anyone who isn't spider-man, even if they're in his way.

Sand man was a good guy for a long period of time until editorial stepped in, Venom is a different case because he's not been a villain most of his career, from 93 to 2000 at least, he was only a villain for his early life when he was debuting in the spiderman book. Once he goes to california he doesn't want to kill spiderman anymore until the sinister six book in the early 00s, and shortly after he auctions the suit. Eddie has literally been a hero/anti-hero longer than he was ever a villain unless you only watch SM3 and some of the cartoons.

He didn't, he tried to and the sinister six thought he was too unstable and crazy to use, they might've briefly used him as a diversion to kill spiderman, but with intent to kill him after he was never a part of the official group. Again it was that short run in the 00s that didn't go anywhere, that hardly undoes the hundred or so issue run before that where he was protecting the homeless in LA.

This was because Eddie as an antagonist for Spiderman never made any sense and editorial never addressed it, so because Eddie being a bad guy didn't work the idea was to get a better suited host who actually had a reason to hate spider-man to be Peter's reverse flash. Every time they tried to make Eddie act like a bad guy fans hated it, and people who "liked it" didn't read the book. The result was a bunch of hosts like Gargan or that one mob boss's kid getting the suit, and eventually having it end up on Flash.

My thing is the other dude said post 80s and it’s not true. Vebom has been hunting since the early 2000s . You guys keep saying he’s a hero he’s not. Those pics and articles I posted show this. My thing is you guys keep saying he’s a hero when he is basically a villian abs spidey and venom still even fight to this day. So this whole back and forth is silly.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

He literally eats his victims? Like he eats the bad guys I showed you a whole list? Are y’all like confused on what a hero and a villain is ? in the damn movie he eats people . But yea he’s def Superman

You clearly aren’t listening. I’ve explained this to you numerous times and you refuse to acknowledge it. But in case you have a reading problem let me say it again: Venom does not eat people. He stated in the comics HIMSELF that his lust for brains is a catchphrase. The ONE time he actually did it due to being sleep deprived he immediately regretted it and vomited it up. That was the ONLY TIME Venom has eaten someone. Him eating people in the film is inaccurate to the character.

 

[ironwez20]

He always talks about eating brains and pancreases, he doesn't actually do that until the government run where the suit does it by accident, and without his knowledge.


That's ultimate Venom, that is not mainline venom, and the fact that you had to go out of your way to cherry pick a comic page to prove yourself right while you ignore literally all of his history is telling.

Lol ok that is ultimate venom didn’t even notice . Been awhile since I read ultimate. That’s my bad.

 

[ironwez20]

You clearly aren’t listening. I’ve explained this to you numerous times and you refuse to acknowledge it. But in case you have a reading problem let me say it again: Venom does not eat people. He stated in the comics HIMSELF that his lust for brains is a catchphrase. The ONE time he actually did it due to being sleep deprived he immediately regretted it and vomited it up. That was the ONLY TIME Venom has eaten someone. Him eating people in the film is inaccurate to the character.

Ah. Ok well I was wrong then about him eating bad guys. however I still don’t consider him a hero as he still stalked and tried to kill Spider-Man well into the early 2000s . Still don’t find him to be heroic or any type of hero at all. He definitely wanted to kill and threaten lives. That’s a fact. Also you didn’t try to explain it to me you could have just lead with this. You just told me to read more comics .

 

[faker]

You clearly aren’t listening. I’ve explained this to you numerous times and you refuse to acknowledge it. But in case you have a reading problem let me say it again: Venom does not eat people. He stated in the comics HIMSELF that his lust for brains is a catchphrase. The ONE time he actually did it due to being sleep deprived he immediately regretted it and vomited it up. That was the ONLY TIME Venom has eaten someone. Him eating people in the film is inaccurate to the character.

He did leave out the government run, where the suit leaves Eddie and eats a criminal on it's own because it was starving to death, which Eddie deeply regrets and so does the suit. I completely forgot about that dumpster incident was that the one that led into the multiple head suit transformation?

I also don't remember that issue wtih Flash, I know he eats a whole terrorirst and spits out his arm with the detonator to the bomb that would've killed the people he was trying to rescue.

 

[faker]

Ah. Ok well I was wrong then about him eating bad guys. however I still don’t consider him a hero as he still stalked and tried to kill Spider-Man well into the early 2000s .

No he didn't, he explicitly stops hunting spiderman as of the issue where Spiderman saves Anne Weying, and she tells off Venom for being an idiot, immediately after that he goes to california. Spiderman even visted him a couple of times to get him to help fight Carnage or other bad guys when no one else was around.

Still don’t find him to be heroic or any type of hero at all. He definitely wanted to kill and threaten lives. That’s a fact

He doesn't go after anybody but Spider-man, and when he gets somebody caught in the cross fire he regrets it, his whole messed up reason for trying to kill Spider-man was that he endangered innocents needlessly which is how he wound up as Venom, in his eyes.

Further, when he's on the tropical island relaxing after he believes he killed Spider-man, Darkhawk shows up, nearly dead, and tries to fight Venom, who obliges, but specifically doesn't kill him, as he's a hero and he's gravely injured. Venom doesn't like to kill people who aren't threatening other people, he especially hates killing innocents.

 

[Fr0stbit3]

He did leave out the government run, where the suit leaves Eddie and eats a criminal on it's own because it was starving to death, which Eddie deeply regrets and so does the suit. I completely forgot about that dumpster incident was that the one that led into the multiple head suit transformation?

I also don't remember that issue wtih Flash, I know he eats a whole terrorirst and spits out his arm with the detonator to the bomb that would've killed the people he was trying to rescue.

Nah it wasn’t the madness one. Just checked. Not sure when it was to be honest

 

[ironwez20]

No he didn't, he explicitly stops hunting spiderman as of the issue where Spiderman saves Anne Weying, and she tells off Venom for being an idiot, immediately after that he goes to california. Spiderman even visted him a couple of times to get him to help fight Carnage or other bad guys when no one else was around.

He doesn't go after anybody but Spider-man, and when he gets somebody caught in the cross fire he regrets it, his whole messed up reason for trying to kill Spider-man was that he endangered innocents needlessly which is how he wound up as Venom, in his eyes.

Further, when he's on the tropical island relaxing after he believes he killed Spider-man, Darkhawk shows up, nearly dead, and tries to fight Venom, who obliges, but specifically doesn't kill him, as he's a hero and he's gravely injured. Venom doesn't like to kill people who aren't threatening other people, he especially hates killing innocents.

Again like I said he’s still a villain to me. And I’m sorry but I’m sure they fought after he left California a couple times. So you mean to tell me Spider-Man and venom never fought at all after he left? I’m not sure if that’s the case. Maybe enlighten me.
Also no his reason for killing Spider-Man was that he ruined his life and called him out. He found himself innocent and thought that Spider-Man preyed on innocent victims. His intentions were that he felt wronged. Has nothing to do with innocent lives. He got called out on a lie

 

[Fr0stbit3]

Again like I said he’s still a villain to me. And I’m sorry but I’m sure they fought after he left California a couple times. So you mean to tell me Spider-Man and venom never fought at all after he left? I’m not sure if that’s the case. Maybe enlighten me.
Also no his reason for killing Spider-Man was that he ruined his life and called him out. He found himself innocent and thought that Spider-Man preyed on innocent victims. His intentions were that he felt wronged. Has nothing to do with innocent lives. He got called out on a lie

Technically his abusive father put the “Eddie is innocent” thought in his head after Eddie killed someone in a drunk driver accident. Eddie wanted to turn himself in but his dead beat the crap out of him and demanded he repeat “I’m innocent” nonstop.

 

[ironwez20]

Technically his abusive father put the “Eddie is innocent” thought in his head after Eddie killed someone in a drunk driver accident. Eddie wanted to turn himself in but his dead beat the crap out of him and demanded he repeat “I’m innocent” nonstop.

That’s from the venom origin book ? Also he was taught to be a good liar which got him in trouble in the sin eater case.

 

[ironwez20]

Also I’ll gladly admit when I was wrong and I was wrong about the eating people . Sorry I dragged that out.