Somehow Rey Returned

[Kebron]

Now that's a good point and I have another real world experience as an example.

I was an amateur fighter. Not exceptional in any way -- won some, lost some -- but experienced enough. After I retired from fighting due to age I took up fencing out of curiosity.

I had held swords before, even had 'duels' with other people who had little or no formal training that came down to athleticism (timing, reflexes and all that jazz) -- so I was already fit with decent timing, eyes and athleticism, relatively calm under attack.

First time I picked up a foil and faced my formally trained and experienced instructor, he showed me how quickly I would die.

Very, very quickly.

So on the one hand I want to hand wave Rey's duel away as her being an experienced fighter using the unfamiliar lightsaber as a staff (for thrusting) against a badly wounded opponent.

But now you have me remembering how utterly useless I was against a trained, competitive fencer that knew what he was doing in spite of years of combat sports.

Foil fencing and lightsaber fighting are two different things. Lightsabers would be more like longsword with the sweeping strikes, two hands on the hilt, and wide open field of engagement. Sometimes it delves into a one handed sabre style of fighting (Dooku), but even then it's a huge departure from foil fencing.

I've been in HEMA (longsword, saber, shield and buckler specifically) for about 5 years now, I see new fighters score the occasional hit against experienced ones, even ones who have won tournaments.

When you factor in that Kylo was wounded, and Rey overcame her fear and let the Force guide her, it's more believable, that she could of beaten him.

 

[Otomofan]

No, it's not. In his very first scene, we see this guy catch and hold a laser bolt with his mind. He clearly knows what he's doing. There's no reason to believe he wouldn't have decapitated her in seconds. She shouldn't have beaten her.

 

[ZE_501]

Foil fencing and lightsaber fighting are two different things. Lightsabers would be more like longsword with the sweeping strikes, two hands on the hilt, and wide open field of engagement. Sometimes it delves into a one handed sabre style of fighting (Dooku), but even then it's a huge departure from foil fencing.

All of this is sound. I still think that technique and experience are very dangerous/often lethal to an untrained opponent.

I've been in HEMA (longsword, saber, shield and buckler specifically) for about 5 years now, I see new fighters score the occasional hit against experienced ones, even ones who have won tournaments.

Oh it definitely happens. The few times I played with my HEMA acquaintances I preferred using a buckler -- I felt it gave me more time to think. Still got my ass whupped though.

When you factor in that Kylo was wounded, and Rey overcame her fear and let the Force guide her, it's more believable, that she could of beaten him.

That's my go-to -- homeboy took a direct hit from Chewbacca's bowcaster. That's gonna leave a mark.

 

[Sachiel]

I'm not taking sides, but I do find it annoying that people think Rey should have been completely clueless with respect to wielding a lightsaber when it was already established that she could handle herself just fine with her staff. Growing up a scavenger & having to defend herself (& probably fight off others vying for the same spare parts), she obviously would have developed some combat skills. That said, in her TFA battle with injured Kylo it was still apparent that (a) she had no actual technique to speak of and (b) he could have dispatched her easily upon having her trapped, leaning perilously over a gaping crevasse, if not for telling her she needed a teacher and then pausing interminably so she had ample time to turn herself over to the Force. Now I do think they overdid it from that point on; the Force controlling her actions should have been just enough to let her fight back adequately to facilitate an escape - she shouldn't have defeated Kylo like she did, regardless of his injuries or emotional state.

Kylo: "You need a teacher! I can show you the way to the force!"

Rey: "Um, excuse you? I'm a Strong, Independent Woman Who Don't Need No Man!"

*FEMALE EMPOWERMENT ACTIVATED*

 

[Misterbadguy]

Can only echo what everyone else has already said - wish the best for Ridley, she's very good and absolutely no issue with her taking the bag Disney are offering, but I've no interest in these films.

 

[The Buffinator]

Reading this back and forth on Kylo & Rey, I have to ask: Where did we get this idea that Kylo was this masterful/advanced lightsaber duelist who's honed his technique after years of training? After all, he was one of the first students at the Luke Skywalker Jedi Academy and let's face it, Luke didn't have ANY one-on-one lightsaber training beyond briefly practicing against a remote on the MF under Obi-Wan's supervision. After that he was last Jedi standing, so unless the Sacred Jedi Texts included a How-To Manual and accompanying Matrix-style battle simulation program, Kylo was taught by the least experienced Jedi ever. Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that when it comes to lightsaber duels it's ALL about whose Force is better at the time.

 

[ZE_501]

Reading this back and forth on Kylo & Rey, I have to ask: Where did we get this idea that Kylo was this masterful/advanced lightsaber duelist who's honed his technique after years of training? After all, he was one of the first students at the Luke Skywalker Jedi Academy and let's face it, Luke didn't have ANY one-on-one lightsaber training beyond briefly practicing against a remote on the MF under Obi-Wan's supervision. After that he was last Jedi standing, so unless the Sacred Jedi Texts included a How-To Manual and accompanying Matrix-style battle simulation program, Kylo was taught by the least experienced Jedi ever. Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that when it comes to lightsaber duels it's ALL about whose Force is better at the time.

The lightsaber training thing is pretty weird when you think about it for too long.

 

[jye4ever]

Reading this back and forth on Kylo & Rey, I have to ask: Where did we get this idea that Kylo was this masterful/advanced lightsaber duelist who's honed his technique after years of training? After all, he was one of the first students at the Luke Skywalker Jedi Academy and let's face it, Luke didn't have ANY one-on-one lightsaber training beyond briefly practicing against a remote on the MF under Obi-Wan's supervision. After that he was last Jedi standing, so unless the Sacred Jedi Texts included a How-To Manual and accompanying Matrix-style battle simulation program, Kylo was taught by the least experienced Jedi ever. Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that when it comes to lightsaber duels it's ALL about whose Force is better at the time.

I respect the hate TROS gets I really do I only blame Lucas for waiting too long with the original cast so long that the obvious thing to do never happened. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

But there are scenes in there that I absolutely love.

Raging ocean lightsaber battle is pretty damn fun still the best lightsabers have ever sounded and looked.

There is actual force push affecting the energy beam along with rain fizzing on it just epic.

Han Leia / Rey Kylo resolution, no problem.

Palpatine chewing up the scene as usual, fun!

Lando arriving with the cavalry and his laugh, fun

Everything just works for me.

Alien dance in the desert, not so fun lol

I forgot if you are a ST hater or not lol

 

[Kebron]

Oh it definitely happens. The few times I played with my HEMA acquaintances I preferred using a buckler -- I felt it gave me more time to think. Still got my ass whupped though.

Buckler was the one I struggled the most with when I started. Kept using it strictly for protection instead of using it as a second weapon. Still not the best at it, but I do like how its more close quarters and I can use my size, as opposed to Longsword which is about keeping people at a distance. But I do love the look and feel of Longsword fencing.

 

[ZE_501]

Buckler was the one I struggled the most with when I started. Kept using it strictly for protection instead of using it as a second weapon. Still not the best at it, but I do like how its more close quarters and I can use my size, as opposed to Longsword which is about keeping people at a distance. But I do love the look and feel of Longsword fencing.

See, that's why I loved the buckler ... I don't know if I was doing it wrong but I would get it out ahead of me, often opponents would think I was more open than I was, allowing me to swing my weapon more effectively. When I did combat sports I preferred close quarters most of the time too, so reading the above it's not surprising I gravitated towards buckler.

 

[Kebron]

See, that's why I loved the buckler ... I don't know if I was doing it wrong but I would get it out ahead of me, often opponents would think I was more open than I was, allowing me to swing my weapon more effectively. When I did combat sports I preferred close quarters most of the time too, so reading the above it's not surprising I gravitated towards buckler.

If you look at the I33 manuals buckler out in front provides the most advantage. You can tell by ow large they drew the buckler indicating when it offered the most protection. There's a lot of different school of thoughts and theories across all the historical manuals though.

I end up using my sword with the buckler together to lock up the opponent's sword, then whichever is easier to unbind hit them in the head with it, usually it's the buckler cause it's smaller. Again, a lot of different schools of thoughts and tactics which are considered superior, but this style works for me. Sounds easy and simple, but it's a lot more complex than I described you have to watch and wait (or lure) them into a guard that makes the situation favorable for you.

 

[wormlander]

The man in the Vader suit is calculated, cerebral, and in total control. For me, PT Anakin just simply does not work as a believable candidate to transition into that OT Vader.

The truth has been spoken

 

[ZE_501]

If you look at the I33 manuals buckler out in front provides the most advantage.

Seems I discovered that by accident.

The whole reason I resorted to that was to tie up the attacker's attention and swings, because I wasn't confident in my own swordsmanship and needed to slow things down.

I end up using my sword with the buckler together to lock up the opponent's sword, then whichever is easier to unbind hit them in the head with it, usually it's the buckler cause it's smaller.

This is why I loved the clinch in Muay Thai. Locks up the opponent's hands (and long range kicks) and then it's either a knee to the body or head, or elbows to the head.

Sounds easy and simple, but it's a lot more complex than I described you have to watch and wait (or lure) them into a guard that makes the situation favorable for you.

Makes sense.

 

[Kebron]

Yeah, the more I think about it, the more I'm convinced that when it comes to lightsaber duels it's ALL about whose Force is better at the time.

I think that's what the first Rey vs Kylo fight was trying to show. He beat her easily when she tried to fight on her own. When she listened to the Force at the end, that's when things changed. Or at least that's what I remember, haven't watched it in a couple years.

 

[Kebron]

No, it's not. In his very first scene, we see this guy catch and hold a laser bolt with his mind. He clearly knows what he's doing. There's no reason to believe he wouldn't have decapitated her in seconds. She shouldn't have beaten her.

It's clear for earlier scenes he didn't want to kill her.

When he stopped the blaster bolt he wasn't shot in the gut and bleeding out, and he was calm and in control. That fight in the end he was severely wounded, and emotionally unstable. He wasn't at the top of his game.

 

[ZE_501]

It's clear for earlier scenes he didn't want to kill her.

When he stopped the blaster bolt he wasn't shot in the gut and bleeding out, and he was calm and in control. That fight in the end he was severely wounded, and emotionally unstable. He wasn't at the top of his game.

Oh yeah, somehow totally forgot he'd just looked dad in the face and stabbed him to death. Obi Wan and Yoda would've been proud.

 

[DarkChocobi]

this thread is hilarious, heavily reminiscent back to the time (probably during 2017-2018) when I was extremely angry and toxic towards ST fanatics. Now, I just simply don't care...I live free and enjoy collecting plastic dollies.

 

[Random_Retard]

this thread is hilarious, heavily reminiscent back to the time (probably during 2017-2018) when I was extremely angry and toxic towards ST fanatics. Now, I just simply don't care...I live free and enjoy collecting plastic dollies.

This is the way!

 

[CessnaDriver]

Yeah that $10 you didn’t spend on a cinema ticket will go far

Bargain night maybe. When I end up truly loving a Star Wars "insert media product" That means buying some higher end products for me... Hot Toys, prop replicas, etc. So far that has only been OT, Rogue One, Mando and Andor. Mando is going shaky bad now, and I hope Andor season 2 can give us some serious Rebellion epic action/drama. Remains to be seen.

 

[ironwez20]

this thread is hilarious, heavily reminiscent back to the time (probably during 2017-2018) when I was extremely angry and toxic towards ST fanatics. Now, I just simply don't care...I live free and enjoy collecting plastic dollies.

Same. I don’t care anymore. I have my canon and if Disney wants to destroy their own brand let them. I enjoyed Star Wars when I was a kid and young adult . I have my good memories. They can’t take that away.