Why hasn't Bale been praised for Batman role in TDK?

[Azrael23]

How can anyone say he's the same person when all of his
characters are vastly different from one another. Personally I
don't think Bale is underrated in general, but his portrayal in TDK
was, along with the entire cast say Ledger.

 

[Riko]

I agree. But we also should consider that when he's Batman there is not
much a person really can bring in terms of emotions, I don't think the
character leaves much room for it. Now when he's Wayne, you can definitely see it.

indeed, that's just want I want to say!

What more can you give a character like batman than Bale gave it?
His emotion spree in the interrogation room, not many other actors could pull that off imo...

so if you gonna evaluate Bale's performance, evaluate him as Bruce Wayne, and indeed, he was a convincing cool playboy.

 

[Azrael23]

There are certain moments in TDK where I think Bale is pretty bad actually (well, at least the Bat-voice). Examples:

"This city... just showed you... that it's full. Of people. Ready to believe in gooooooood!"

and

"Evem someone as good as you. Can fall! So point it. At the people. Responsible!"



Conversely, when he's not over-doing it (like in those two examples) and he's almost whispering his voice sounds much, much better and cooler. IMHO, the best Batvoice he's ever done is when Joker has Rachel ("Drop the gun." & "Let her go.") and at the end with Gordon ("But the Joker cannot win.") It's the over-done Batvoice that brings the guffaws. When I saw it in the theater people were actually snickering and laughing during the interrogation scene.

Thats odd, because the interrogation scene was Bale at his best, its pretty
much one of the highlight scenes of the film, not to mention I think that
Bale was trying to show some facial emotion through his mask, so I think
that scene played well, and so did the voice.

 

[Riko]

I could have sworn I typed TDK - (without) Ledger would have been as mediocre as the above mentioned movies. I absolutely LOVED TDK, I saw it 3 times in Imax. I was trying to make a point, maybe some bad examples but just trying to note that Ledger made the film what it was.

Nolan directed a great film, did a smoking job from start to end but again no Ledger no deal.

the film itself was rocksolid, with or without ledger.
Ledger gave it something extra...

same you can say about the Terminator movies.
especially T2 was rock solid movie by itself (it had everything)
but Arnold gave it something extra...that made it the classic it is today

same can be said about TDK imo
you'll see, in years time, TDK will still be rock solid and I might even say be called a classic in its genre, o wait, it is already a classic in its genre

 

[Voorhees27]

How can anyone say he's the same person when all of his
characters are vastly different from one another. Personally I
don't think Bale is underrated in general, but his portrayal in TDK
was, along with the entire cast say Ledger.

Could the reason you've become my personal pcychic be because you have a personal vendetta against Ledger? Jealous maybe, resentful? You just contradicted yourself here.

Now who is the one becomming condescending just to get your point across.

Sound familiar?

I love bringing the dummy out in people.

 

[Azrael23]

so if you gonna evaluate Bale's performance, evaluate him as Bruce Wayne, and indeed, he was a convincing cool playboy.

Precisely. Another aspect people forget to evaluate is when he is clearly
his Batman persona while not actually donning the attire. Just look at the
intensity in his mannerism, voice and eyes when he is speaking to Alfred
in his lab, or when he's in his penthouse grieving the death of Rachel. Its
the subtle thing people tend to miss, when he's actually being Batman, but
isn't wearing his cape and cowl.

 

[Riko]

That's pushing it a bit.

Quite a lot, actually.

Not to mention you're severely underestimating Nolan as a director and visionary. Let's not forget that the 2nd best superhero film of all time under TDK is Batman Begins, and Ledger was nowhere in sight.

I hate to break it to the Ledger-crowd, but Nolan could've demanded that performance out of most trained actors. He wrote the words, and he envisioned the Joker the way it was translated on-screen.

Ledger read the script.

and you are pushing it a lot yourself to. You simplyfy Ledgers creative input in this.
Who doubts that the look and feel and quality of the whole picture comes from the vision of Nolan? NO BODY! (I hope )
but talking about The Joker from Ledger by itself is a different thing

example: the clapping of the joker in jail when Gordon was appointed commissioner = Ledger improvisation, no script as a lead there...

+ a script is only words, it can't fully 100% say how Ledger should "be" on screen, his movements, his way of speach, his lips, his tongue.
Just wanna point out, the script is much, but it ain't everything ESPECIALLY with Ledger's Joker.
The guy spent a whole month preparing in his hotel room for gods sake

Nolan chose Ledger because Nolan gave Ledger free interpretation of the character, he let him do the creative work on this one because he knew Ledger would nale it!

 

[Riko]

Man, I hate it when people go on about a film wouldn't have been as good without a certain actor.

That actor was part of the film, so guessing how it would be without them is nonsense. 'Er...yeh....Scarface wouldn't have been as great without Al Pacino'.....yea, but he IS in that film which makes it great!

²
terminator etc

I would even "hate" Goodfellas if it hadn't had Joe Pesci in it what a stupid movie!

or wait, The Godfather would SUCK without Pacino and Brando.
I bet that movie would suck without all the Human Characters in it....

 

[Azrael23]

Could the reason you've become my personal pcychic be because you have a personal vendetta against Ledger? Jealous maybe, resentful? You just contradicted yourself here.

Now who is the one becomming condescending just to get your point across.

Sound familiar?

I love bringing the dummy out in people.

Tell me you aren't serious? A vendetta? resentment?
You've actually made yourself look far worse than before. Perhaps
you should spend less time on the net, because I'm willing to bet you
know next to nothing about Ledger outside his portrayal of Joker.
And stating a fact isn't being condescending and neither was it in the
context of your so-called proof. There was no contradiction neither
condescension, but its nice to know you're pathetic enough to follow
each of my postings to try and point one out.

Don't see how I can be either of the two since I gave Ledger his props
in my first response, go back and re-read it. And yes while trying
to bring the alleged dummy out in me, you inadvertently exposed your own stupidity

 

[Voorhees27]

Tell me you aren't serious? A vendetta? resentment?
You've actually made yourself look far worse than before. Perhaps
you should spend less time on the net, because I'm willing to bet you
know next to nothing about Ledger outside his portrayal of Joker.

Don't see how I can be either of the two since I gave Ledger his props
in my first response, go back and re-read it. And yes while trying
to bring the alleged dummy out in me, you inadvertently exposed your own stupidity

To whom? you? So?

 

[Riko]

Mr. Bale, though nothing ground breaking as the Joker, but he still portrayed a better Batman than Mr. Kilmer and Clooney.

again, WTF should bale do with batman to be AS ground breaking as the joker from Ledger? ware his cape and cowl with NOTHING under it bare naked? that would be ground breaking yeah!

The shouting, pissed off batman was ground breaking enough imo.
You can't really do anything more with batman than with the joker...Batman is batman, there is just not so much margin with the character.

 

[Azrael23]

again, WTF should bale do with batman to be AS ground breaking as the joker from Ledger? ware his cape and cowl with NOTHING under it bare naked? that would be ground breaking yeah!

The shouting, pissed off batman was ground breaking enough imo.
You can't really do anything more with batman than with the joker...Batman is batman, there is just not so much margin with the character.

Bare naked?

 

[Riko]

Thats odd, because the interrogation scene was Bale at his best, its pretty
much one of the highlight scenes of the film, not to mention I think that
Bale was trying to show some facial emotion through his mask, so I think
that scene played well, and so did the voice.

² will post a screenshot of that facial emotion later
it was indeed a highlight, his face, the emotion, the stakes, yess: the voice! without that voice on THAT moment, that scene would have lost a lot of its power. Maybe when they started with that voice it was meant for that one soul purpuse: the interrogation scene

*punch* WHERE ARE THEY *punch* WHERE ARE THEY

 

[Riko]

Precisely. Another aspect people forget to evaluate is when he is clearly
his Batman persona while not actually donning the attire. Just look at the
intensity in his mannerism, voice and eyes when he is speaking to Alfred
in his lab, or when he's in his penthouse grieving the death of Rachel. Its
the subtle thing people tend to miss, when he's actually being Batman, but
isn't wearing his cape and cowl.

to be batman is to be able to control your self, I mean, you must have a certain "cool".

Keaton had it also immensly!
even Clooney has it, we all know that, but we know that based on other roles, not as batman

But you can see a big difference between the Bale in the Batmovies and the bale in Harsh Times, I recommend this movie to everybody.

 

[Jack Ups]

a cliché: taste is personal BUT ledger DID make this movie
Don't get me wrong, it's not like I say without Ledger the movie would suck, not at all, it had a whole lot of other interesesting aspects (story, action, emotion, Bale...etc) but Ledger sure made his mark in this movie.
That is why he has so many nominations, that is why he will win a lot of his nominations, and that is why Bale has in comparison with Ledger much less nominations.
I repeat, Bale was good, solid and Bad-ass, but not price-worthy.
Why do some always have to exagurate a certain performance?

the oscars haven't been given to Ledger yet, and some already whine about "Bale's underrated performance", wtf.
first things first, give credit to who it comes LEDGER



ps: I loved the voice don't understand the whining about it, it fitted, batman is hard, batman is badass, batman is all about placing fear in the onces that pray on the fearfull, so a raspy voice is a nice element of the whole purpose imo.

Oh yeah lol i understand as a fan of the film that for the majority of people that Ledger did make the film for them, i was only really stating that you cant say it did that for 100% everyone, but yeah he pretty much got the most praise and why not he derserved it.
I just said while i dont mind if Bale doesnt win anything, he did a damn good job, as much as Ledger at the end of the day, when communicating the character to the audience, not saying one is better than the other, lol hope that sounds right

 

[Azrael23]

to be batman is to be able to control your self, I mean, you must have a certain "cool".

Keaton had it also immensly!
even Clooney has it, we all know that, but we know that based on other roles, not as batman

But you can see a big difference between the Bale in the Batmovies and the bale in Harsh Times, I recommend this movie to everybody.

Exactly. There is an intensity in Bale's eyes that I believe very few actors
that have portrayed the character has and its seen in the interrogation scene
Harsh Times was a good film, defiantly a huge difference in terms of character.

 

[aussieinnyc]

There are certain moments in TDK where I think Bale is pretty bad actually (well, at least the Bat-voice). Examples:

"This city... just showed you... that it's full. Of people. Ready to believe in gooooooood!"

and

"Evem someone as good as you. Can fall! So point it. At the people. Responsible!"



Conversely, when he's not over-doing it (like in those two examples) and he's almost whispering his voice sounds much, much better and cooler. IMHO, the best Batvoice he's ever done is when Joker has Rachel ("Drop the gun." & "Let her go.") and at the end with Gordon ("But the Joker cannot win.") It's the over-done Batvoice that brings the guffaws. When I saw it in the theater people were actually snickering and laughing during the interrogation scene.

I agree totally. It's over-acting to try to compensate for the suit restricting what facial emotions he can convey. Plus he's having to deal with dialogue that is pretty schmaltzy - even without a couple of pounds of rubber on his head and a story-driven need to disguise his voice it would be pretty difficult to find the subtlety needed to sell those lines. Still, it's a continuing problem Bale will have to learn to deal with if he's to keep playing the character - his voice acting has come under criticism in both films. I still think the scene in BB where he interrogates Flass is beyond ridiculous - the delivery of the lines is incredibly "one-note" and the snarling/visibly shaking with rage thing so overdone that anytime I watch it I cringe.

I understand the reasons behind the delivery of the TDK lines quoted above (he's tired, out of breath, in pain, upset, etc) but there's a fine line between intense and melodramatic and unfortunately Bale steps over it (or Nolan pushes him) in the Bat persona on a number of occasions. I don't have as much of a problem with the interrogation scene though - maybe it's because the physical violence is at the same level as the intensity of the line delivery.

 

[POWER1010]

Even though a grown man in a a puffy-faced, rubber Bat costume beating the crap out of a clown in a gritty, "realistic" interrogation scene, isn't?

It works in the context of the movie, but I still find the scene ridiculous.

UH-Huh....keep digging that hole.

Do you even understand what Batman is all about

 

[Morbach]

Bale deserves alot of praise. He does an amazing Batman and is great in every movie he does. He's a terrific actor and deserves a ton of praise for his role as Batman.

 

[Dr.Mirakle32]

UH-Huh....keep digging that hole.

Do you even understand what Batman is all about

A nutty rich guy with alot of cool toys and a complex, who dresses up like a bat to scare and beat the crap out of criminals, because one happened to kill his parents when he was a kid?

I'm as big a Batman fan as most people, but the character is still obviously pretty ridiculous, especially when he's portrayed in a "gritty", "realistic" setting.

I thought Tim Burton did the best job at capturing the tone and world of Batman. It had the perfect blend of darkness, seriousness and tounge-in cheek humor, without turning it into a full-on spoof (though Nolan's films have stronger shooting scripts.)

I still really like Nolan's films, especially Begins, I just thought the entire tone of TDK was taken way too seriously, save for the Joker (which seems to be why everybody loved Ledger's portrayal. )