The Amazing Spider Man 2 (2014)

[AIR]

Big spoilers below.

After thinking over ASM2 for a couple days now I figured I'd take a moment to articulate some thoughts.

I. Love it. A lot.

This is a movie about mortality and making the most/best of whatever time you have and also what you do when you lose something you desperately want. How can some of you say it didn't have a theme? They played Gwen's speech twice. Norman's terminal illness, Harry's terminal illness, Gwen's impending doom, Electro's loss of the one "friend" he thought he had, Peter's loss of Gwen, and the city's loss of Spider-Man.

One on side we saw the bad guys using their own mortality as an excuse to commit evil actions and Gwen, in the prime of her life, sacrificing her health for the sake of good. Of course she didn't willingly fall to her death but she very deliberately put herself in harm's way to help the city knowing full well the risks. Norman, Harry, and Gwen are kind of the "mortality" trinity and Peter, Electro, and the little kid are kind of the "what do you do when you lose your buddy" trinity.

And we got to see extremes in each group.

Let me pause for a second to acknowledge, yeah, the movie had some editing and pacing issues. They are there. No question. But when I watched that film they weren't deal breakers they were just diversions in a truly amazing cinematic experience. Because throughout the whole movie there were the most incredible Spider-Man sequences, believable and charming relationship chemistry (I can understand if some people thought it was eye-rolling but I got a kick out of their "ground rules" discussion and Emma Stone's effortless portrayal of Gwen. "Well I'm sorry I didn't take you to the 'Bahamas' of hiding places." )

And I just thought Electro was entertaining in a fun throwback kind of way. So for every tangent about Peter's dad or some rushed quip about "hope" or something there was a handful of jaw dropping web slinging or funny/charming moments in all acts of the film. Other people see a movie that was all over the place but I look at it as having a solid thread with some unnecessary tangents. To each his own and all.

But what really gets me is Peter picking himself up by his bootstraps at the end. THAT'S that clincher. Electro lost his perceived friendship with Spider-Man and went ballistic. The kid lost the hero that saved him from bullies but decided that it would just have to be HIS time to stand up to the ultimate bully in the middle of the street. Peter lost Gwen obviously, and, like the boy, decided to take her message to heart and live it. I could get choked up just thinking about him showing up at the Rhino standoff and taking a moment to crack a few jokes. Yeah, its five months later but just that he didn't just show up, but that he did so *enthusiastically* rather than with his head down may just instantly make him my #2 favorite cinematic superhero.

He isn't a hero because he apprehends bad guys anymore. He's a hero because when everything is lost he goes out and does what needs to be done because it's right and he cares about other people. He inspires others to stand up to evil but still has their back when they are faced with overwhelming opposition. What a refreshing and uplifting experience.

 

[Silrian]

Hm yeah I actually would agree with you. I dislike both hipsters and sheep, so to speak. I like it when people have a very well thought out opinion, regardless of what that opinion is or whether I agree.

You could accuse me of both depending on what film you take, but I genuinely will defend I am neither. And I will also say often calling someone either a fanboy or a hater is out of the fact that you (meant generally from here onward) yourself just have a very strong opinion of it, in either case.

I have to say though, recently one of my favourite movie reviewers, Kofi Outlaw, went out to say fans are ruining the community around cb films and honestly, I'm starting to agree. And not just because of the retarded marvel vs dc bs. People should really stop chastising others for their opinion, or acting as if they're view on something is the only right one – in 9 out of 10 cases it's not, in those 9 cases it's hubris. The greatest minds in human history were wrong about a lot of things, all the time. Maybe it's naive to expect a more mature form of communication about properties based on source material that was and still is largely meant for young audiences, but it's just so childish to think everyone is an idiot as long as they don't agree with your logic behind something.

One can disagree without having to be a d!ck about it.

I could care less what the quote-unquote grain is. There's people who agree with me and people who don't. Sometimes those agreeing are the majority, sometimes the minority, massive whatever.

 

[Silrian]

I don't see why Khev would be sarcastic. I actually agree with a chunk of it. I just wish they'd made 1 film, instead of two and mashing them together in the most forced and awkward way I've seen in long time.

Somewhere in the fusion of ASM1 and 2 is the most brilliant spider-man film ever made. Perhaps if it had just been Peter, Gwen and Harry. No parent BS origin story, just Spidey up and coming and Harry coming to grips with his mortality, more scenes between all of them and Norman. And there were enough muggers and other criminals to show off the brilliant spider-man action, with ultimately him facing very well written and developed Goblin and *clock tower*, that one spider-man film could've been brilliant.

 

[Khev]

Not sarcastic.

 

[Uncanny Web-Slinger]

Big spoilers below.

After thinking over ASM2 for a couple days now I figured I'd take a moment to articulate some thoughts.

I. Love it. A lot.

This is a movie about mortality and making the most/best of whatever time you have and also what you do when you lose something you desperately want. How can some of you say it didn't have a theme? They played Gwen's speech twice. Norman's terminal illness, Harry's terminal illness, Gwen's impending doom, Electro's loss of the one "friend" he thought he had, Peter's loss of Gwen, and the city's loss of Spider-Man.

One on side we saw the bad guys using their own mortality as an excuse to commit evil actions and Gwen, in the prime of her life, sacrificing her health for the sake of good. Of course she didn't willingly fall to her death but she very deliberately put herself in harm's way to help the city knowing full well the risks. Norman, Harry, and Gwen are kind of the "mortality" trinity and Peter, Electro, and the little kid are kind of the "what do you do when you lose your buddy" trinity.

And we got to see extremes in each group.

Let me pause for a second to acknowledge, yeah, the movie had some editing and pacing issues. They are there. No question. But when I watched that film they weren't deal breakers they were just diversions in a truly amazing cinematic experience. Because throughout the whole movie there were the most incredible Spider-Man sequences, believable and charming relationship chemistry (I can understand if some people thought it was eye-rolling but I got a kick out of their "ground rules" discussion and Emma Stone's effortless portrayal of Gwen. "Well I'm sorry I didn't take you to the 'Bahamas' of hiding places." )

And I just thought Electro was entertaining in a fun throwback kind of way. So for every tangent about Peter's dad or some rushed quip about "hope" or something there was a handful of jaw dropping web slinging or funny/charming moments in all acts of the film. Other people see a movie that was all over the place but I look at it as having a solid thread with some unnecessary tangents. To each his own and all.

But what really gets me is Peter picking himself up by his bootstraps at the end. THAT'S that clincher. Electro lost his perceived friendship with Spider-Man and went ballistic. The kid lost the hero that saved him from bullies but decided that it would just have to be HIS time to stand up to the ultimate bully in the middle of the street. Peter lost Gwen obviously, and, like the boy, decided to take her message to heart and live it. I could get choked up just thinking about him showing up at the Rhino standoff and taking a moment to crack a few jokes. Yeah, its five months later but just that he didn't just show up, but that he did so *enthusiastically* rather than with his head down may just instantly make him my #2 favorite cinematic superhero.

He isn't a hero because he apprehends bad guys anymore. He's a hero because when everything is lost he goes out and does what needs to be done because it's right and he cares about other people. He inspires others to stand up to evil but still has their back when they are faced with overwhelming opposition. What a refreshing and uplifting experience. Kudos to the filmmaking team for a job well done.

Love that last sentence. One thing I liked about this over any other superhero movie is that there is attention to him as a Superhero of the people. Most other just battle villains whereas Spidey saves people

 

[Silrian]

This film should've decided whether it wanted to target a young audience or not. Some scenes are as goofy and comical on the level of an 8 year old, and some scenes are as dramatic as Nolan's Batman, I feel that sole incapacity to be tonally consistent ruins the entire film for me, I just can't deal with it for some reason.

 

[pturtle]

This film should've decided whether it wanted to target a young audience or not. Some scenes are as goofy and comical on the level of an 8 year old, and some scenes are as dramatic as Nolan's Batman, I feel that sole incapacity to be tonally consistent ruins the entire film for me, I just can't deal with it for some reason.

Tonally, Spider-Man always bridged light hearted humor and dark themes, the tone worked for me. I loved that it just wasn't a kids movie, or some ultra serious dark movie. For the most part, it was a fun, at times campy movie, but didn't shy away from the serious moments the comics had. It had a bit of everything I like in my superhero films. The transition from fun to serious was fine to me, it was nothing like Iron Man 3, a big joke throughout, even when the scene is calling for some real drama (Pepper falling into the fire, then Tony continues on his wisecracking ways).

I would have liked for some villains and characters to be developed a bit better and not be rushed for the sake of making a Sinister 6 film, that's my main problem with the movie, but I enjoyed the movie quite a bit, I'm eager to see where the story goes from here.


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[Silrian]

If it had actually bridged it's two tones it would've been great to me. Editing footage together is not tonally bridging a film... It's just putting sequences behind each other.

As a man of steel fan I will readily say the tone switch between Zod's death + the scream and then immediate cut to Superman dandily conversing with Swanwick was a horrible cut. There's an actual bridging scene missing there.

This whole effin movie felt like that to me. It was an incommunicable compromise which to me destroyed the point in both things it compromised between.

I might actually genuinely try to cut asm1 and 2 into 1 film.

Ftr I'm sad about it there's great stuff in this film with genuine heart and if people can like it then good for them. But mainly all Dillon/Electro scenes I couldn't feel engaged in.

EDIT: to rephrase myself, I felt engaged by all of it, but I couldn't combine the different tones and constantly switch back and forth between them. If that's my shortcoming, sad for me I guess.

Although is there anyone here who doesn't feel like at the very least Harry is underdeveloped?

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

Hm yeah I actually would agree with you. I dislike both hipsters and sheep, so to speak. I like it when people have a very well thought out opinion, regardless of what that opinion is or whether I agree.

You could accuse me of both depending on what film you take, but I genuinely will defend I am neither. And I will also say often calling someone either a fanboy or a hater is out of the fact that you (meant generally from here onward) yourself just have a very strong opinion of it, in either case.

I have to say though, recently one of my favourite movie reviewers, Kofi Outlaw, went out to say fans are ruining the community around cb films and honestly, I'm starting to agree. And not just because of the retarded marvel vs dc bs. People should really stop chastising others for their opinion, or acting as if they're view on something is the only right one – in 9 out of 10 cases it's not, in those 9 cases it's hubris. The greatest minds in human history were wrong about a lot of things, all the time. Maybe it's naive to expect a more mature form of communication about properties based on source material that was and still is largely meant for young audiences, but it's just so childish to think everyone is an idiot as long as they don't agree with your logic behind something.

One can disagree without having to be a d!ck about it.

I could care less what the quote-unquote grain is. There's people who agree with me and people who don't. Sometimes those agreeing are the majority, sometimes the minority, massive whatever.

I agree with this times a million. I do not want either to fail. There are things to like and dislike about both. People rooting against one or the other are just petty. I want Marvel to continue to do well, because there are characters I want to see introduced in the film universe. Same with DC. I am just trying to stay excited about the glut of comic movies we are getting. I just hope the quality stays up, and I enjoy them.

 

[pturtle]

If it had actually bridged it's two tones it would've been great to me. Editing footage together is not tonally bridging a film... It's just putting sequences behind each other.

As a man of steel fan I will readily say the tone switch between Zod's death + the scream and then immediate cut to Superman dandily conversing with Swanwick was a horrible cut. There's an actual bridging scene missing there.

This whole effin movie felt like that to me. It was an incommunicable compromise which to me destroyed the point in both things it compromised between.

I might actually genuinely try to cut asm1 and 2 into 1 film.

Ftr I'm sad about it there's great stuff in this film with genuine heart and if people can like it then good for them. But mainly all Dillon/Electro scenes I couldn't feel engaged in.

I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree on that, other than the opening scene with Spidey (which I loved), I felt everything flowed organically.


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[Deckard]

I don't think the Marvel VS DC thing comes from either side wanting the other to fail.

It seems to me it's more frustration that Marvel has proved able to adapt anything to the screen where as DC seems incapable(or at very least struggles big time) even with a template to follow right in front of them and more universally recognized properties. Who in the whole world, in any country, hasn't heard of Superman? So why did his movie do worse than Thor?

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

I don't think the Marvel VS DC thing comes from either side wanting the other to fail.

It seems to me it's more frustration that Marvel has proved able to adapt anything to the screen where as DC seems incapable(or at very least struggles big time) even with a template to follow right in front of them and more universally recognized properties. Who in the whole world, in any country, hasn't heard of Superman? So why did his movie do worse than Thor?

I think this has actually hurt DC in some respects. Average Joe knew nothing about Thor. Disney/Marvel had a clean slate to do whatever they wanted. As a Thor fan I have found both films sadly lacking. But I am coming from the Thor fanboy group. And so all the changes that they have made bug me, yet the average joe only knows this movie version. Superman in comparison already had very successful interpretations, the Reeve/Donner film being probably the most well known. For better or worse, this version informs most people's beliefs about Superman and who he is. The Reeve version does match a version in the comics, but so does the Cavil version. Some liked the new version, others didn't. Thor basically had nothing to compare too. The trick will be the Thor reboot we get. When Hemsworth and Hiddleston walk away. Or the bigger test of will we have Thor films the way we have Superman films. Just my thoughts.

 

[a-dev]

That's something I hadn't even thought of, the notion that all the MCU characters could eventually be rebooted. What will they be rebooted into since the shared universe concept is done? Would there be some massive change of tone? Would they try to go really serious ala Nolan?

Or will major superhero fatigue have set in by then and nothing more will come out.

 

[Uncanny Web-Slinger]

I don't think the Marvel VS DC thing comes from either side wanting the other to fail.

That's true but the Disney Marvel vs Other Marvel thing has that 'wanting the other to fail' aspect, that's one-sided though not either side.

 

[Darth Zangetsu]

That's something I hadn't even thought of, the notion that all the MCU characters could eventually be rebooted. What will they be rebooted into since the shared universe concept is done? Would there be some massive change of tone? Would they try to go really serious ala Nolan?

Or will major superhero fatigue have set in by then and nothing more will come out.

I think fatigue will set in after the reboots start. When average joe will start saying _____ is not as good as Chris Evans. or I miss RDJ as Stark, this guy sucks. Disney is going to have to make some decisions fast. Especially with Tony Stark. Do you continue to pony up money to RDJ or do you say it's time to move on and recast. I honestly feel like Hemsworth will be around longer than anyone else. His star has risen but not like Hiddleston's. ScarJo was already a name before Marvel. Ruffalo was considered an actor's actor. Chris Evans has stated he wants to get into writing and directing so he's thinking different career or different aspect. Hemsworth could be Thor for a while, and he's the cheapest to bring back post Avengers 3. DC is in the same boat with Affleck. How many movies are they reasonably going to get out of his Batman?

 

[Deckard]

I think the genre will die out before they need to reboot. It will depend on whether or not video game films are proven successful in time. They are the future though, no doubt about it. If Spielberg is really bringing Halo to Showtime, it could be sooner rather than later.

 

[Uncanny Web-Slinger]

Hell if the VideoGame genre became the new "it" movie genre i'd be stoked. there's so much potential

 

[a-dev]

I was gonna say what would HT do if the superhero genre died out. Well if videogame movies take over...there you go.

 

[Silrian]

Are there long time spider-man comic book readers here? People who've actually read the original comics with gwen stacey?

How do you guys feel about ASM2?

 

[JAWS]

Big spoilers below.

After thinking over ASM2 for a couple days now I figured I'd take a moment to articulate some thoughts.

I. Love it. A lot.

This is a movie about mortality and making the most/best of whatever time you have and also what you do when you lose something you desperately want. How can some of you say it didn't have a theme? They played Gwen's speech twice. Norman's terminal illness, Harry's terminal illness, Gwen's impending doom, Electro's loss of the one "friend" he thought he had, Peter's loss of Gwen, and the city's loss of Spider-Man.

One on side we saw the bad guys using their own mortality as an excuse to commit evil actions and Gwen, in the prime of her life, sacrificing her health for the sake of good. Of course she didn't willingly fall to her death but she very deliberately put herself in harm's way to help the city knowing full well the risks. Norman, Harry, and Gwen are kind of the "mortality" trinity and Peter, Electro, and the little kid are kind of the "what do you do when you lose your buddy" trinity.

And we got to see extremes in each group.

Let me pause for a second to acknowledge, yeah, the movie had some editing and pacing issues. They are there. No question. But when I watched that film they weren't deal breakers they were just diversions in a truly amazing cinematic experience. Because throughout the whole movie there were the most incredible Spider-Man sequences, believable and charming relationship chemistry (I can understand if some people thought it was eye-rolling but I got a kick out of their "ground rules" discussion and Emma Stone's effortless portrayal of Gwen. "Well I'm sorry I didn't take you to the 'Bahamas' of hiding places." )

And I just thought Electro was entertaining in a fun throwback kind of way. So for every tangent about Peter's dad or some rushed quip about "hope" or something there was a handful of jaw dropping web slinging or funny/charming moments in all acts of the film. Other people see a movie that was all over the place but I look at it as having a solid thread with some unnecessary tangents. To each his own and all.

But what really gets me is Peter picking himself up by his bootstraps at the end. THAT'S that clincher. Electro lost his perceived friendship with Spider-Man and went ballistic. The kid lost the hero that saved him from bullies but decided that it would just have to be HIS time to stand up to the ultimate bully in the middle of the street. Peter lost Gwen obviously, and, like the boy, decided to take her message to heart and live it. I could get choked up just thinking about him showing up at the Rhino standoff and taking a moment to crack a few jokes. Yeah, its five months later but just that he didn't just show up, but that he did so *enthusiastically* rather than with his head down may just instantly make him my #2 favorite cinematic superhero.

He isn't a hero because he apprehends bad guys anymore. He's a hero because when everything is lost he goes out and does what needs to be done because it's right and he cares about other people. He inspires others to stand up to evil but still has their back when they are faced with overwhelming opposition. What a refreshing and uplifting experience. Kudos to the filmmaking team for a job well done.

100% agree

This film should've decided whether it wanted to target a young audience or not. Some scenes are as goofy and comical on the level of an 8 year old, and some scenes are as dramatic as Nolan's Batman, I feel that sole incapacity to be tonally consistent ruins the entire film for me, I just can't deal with it for some reason.

Spidey Comics deal with the light and dark side of life. Often in the same issue.

Tonally, Spider-Man always bridged light hearted humor and dark themes, the tone worked for me. I loved that it just wasn't a kids movie, or some ultra serious dark movie. For the most part, it was a fun, at times campy movie, but didn't shy away from the serious moments the comics had. It had a bit of everything I like in my superhero films. The transition from fun to serious was fine to me, it was nothing like Iron Man 3, a big joke throughout, even when the scene is calling for some real drama (Pepper falling into the fire, then Tony continues on his wisecracking ways).

I would have liked for some villains and characters to be developed a bit better and not be rushed for the sake of making a Sinister 6 film, that's my main problem with the movie, but I enjoyed the movie quite a bit, I'm eager to see where the story goes from here.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

What he said

If it had actually bridged it's two tones it would've been great to me. Editing footage together is not tonally bridging a film... It's just putting sequences behind each other.

As a man of steel fan I will readily say the tone switch between Zod's death + the scream and then immediate cut to Superman dandily conversing with Swanwick was a horrible cut. There's an actual bridging scene missing there.

This whole effin movie felt like that to me. It was an incommunicable compromise which to me destroyed the point in both things it compromised between.

I might actually genuinely try to cut asm1 and 2 into 1 film.

Ftr I'm sad about it there's great stuff in this film with genuine heart and if people can like it then good for them. But mainly all Dillon/Electro scenes I couldn't feel engaged in.

EDIT: to rephrase myself, I felt engaged by all of it, but I couldn't combine the different tones and constantly switch back and forth between them. If that's my shortcoming, sad for me I guess.

Although is there anyone here who doesn't feel like at the very least Harry is underdeveloped?

Sorry I stopped reading after "as a man of Steel Fan" ......................... Joking.

Harry was a tad undeveloped but why come down on ASM2 for that when most of the characters in MOS had the same problem?

I guess we're going to have to agree to disagree on that, other than the opening scene with Spidey (which I loved), I felt everything flowed organically.


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Yeah... Tone of the film flowed just fine... Even Spidey wearing a fireman's cap