Biojex
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Are you all ready? Tonight is the night 
Showtime- Twin Peaks (2016)
- Thread starter banthafett
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Pixelpiper
Super Freak
We're going to find out that everything has been a long dream-sequence when Audrey wakes up the morning after the events with Bobbed Coop.
BurningRage
Super Freak
What year is this?
Haha. I await the epic rage of otodam. [sic] 
Sidewinder
Super Freak
Are they ****ing serious with that ending!!!
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I suspected it would go this route, it's typical Lynch.
I had a theory earlier after the first 4 episodes about the meaning behind Code Blue Rose. I know it was a case they opened in the series, but they way Lynch has used Blue Rose in his other films, it's more than just that. It clearly means Dreaming, Hallucination, fantasies etc.
Now, in Episode 17 when Coop sees Naito, he freezes and Says we live inside a dream(Naito doesn't have eyes and can't see the world the way we can) and when they touch, Diane pops up.
And remember in Ep 17 or 18 when the Arm(Tree) in the black lodge says something like "Is this story about Laura, or someone else?". Can't remember the excact words, but it was something like that. Makes me think about Blue Rose and it's Coop's dream.
That, or it could be that he went into the past trying to save Laura. Failed and created an alternate timeline which might be Coop's Limbo? The ending when Laura screams might be the result of Coop failing to save young Laura and everything collapses in this alternate reality too.
But bottom line is, it has been mentioned throughout the show that we live inside a dream, same in Fire Walk with me. And Blue Rose is mentioned many times so...
Might also explain how Audrey's story ended. Dancing in the Bar, then "Wakes up" somewhere.
I had a theory earlier after the first 4 episodes about the meaning behind Code Blue Rose. I know it was a case they opened in the series, but they way Lynch has used Blue Rose in his other films, it's more than just that. It clearly means Dreaming, Hallucination, fantasies etc.
Now, in Episode 17 when Coop sees Naito, he freezes and Says we live inside a dream(Naito doesn't have eyes and can't see the world the way we can) and when they touch, Diane pops up.
And remember in Ep 17 or 18 when the Arm(Tree) in the black lodge says something like "Is this story about Laura, or someone else?". Can't remember the excact words, but it was something like that. Makes me think about Blue Rose and it's Coop's dream.
That, or it could be that he went into the past trying to save Laura. Failed and created an alternate timeline which might be Coop's Limbo? The ending when Laura screams might be the result of Coop failing to save young Laura and everything collapses in this alternate reality too.
But bottom line is, it has been mentioned throughout the show that we live inside a dream, same in Fire Walk with me. And Blue Rose is mentioned many times so...
Might also explain how Audrey's story ended. Dancing in the Bar, then "Wakes up" somewhere.
Sidewinder
Super Freak
Episode 17 was great. I actually only just watched Fire Walk With Me last night for the first time, so it was great to see them relate back to that scene with Laura and James. I really will have to rewatch this season again because it really does relate more to FWWM rather than the series as much I think.
Naido being Dianne turned out to be right....i guess at least some fan theories have been correct.
I just didn't know what to think about episode 18. I'm just glad they bundled it with episode 17 because it would have been a real downer to wait a week for that episode.
I hated the dragged on driving scenes and then the Dianne/Cooper sex scene. Cooper didn't seem like himself again once they crossed over into this alternate universe, or wherever they were. Then we see Laura as this Carrie and upon returning to Twin Peaks there's other people living in this house. Is it too far in the past or too far into the future? Carrie hears Leland calling out "Laura" and then she screams, as if it all is coming back to her.
Perhaps it is all just a dream.
Will they continue on from here or is this the end?
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Naido being Dianne turned out to be right....i guess at least some fan theories have been correct.
I just didn't know what to think about episode 18. I'm just glad they bundled it with episode 17 because it would have been a real downer to wait a week for that episode.
I hated the dragged on driving scenes and then the Dianne/Cooper sex scene. Cooper didn't seem like himself again once they crossed over into this alternate universe, or wherever they were. Then we see Laura as this Carrie and upon returning to Twin Peaks there's other people living in this house. Is it too far in the past or too far into the future? Carrie hears Leland calling out "Laura" and then she screams, as if it all is coming back to her.
Perhaps it is all just a dream.
Will they continue on from here or is this the end?
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Otomofan
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Wow.
Bob.
Wow.
What a mix of emotions.
I loved just about every minute of episode 17 and then episode 18 was only slightly better than a visit to a dentist.
Whoever decided to air them together did the right thing. Can you imagine sitting on the edge of your seat, seeing that insane episode 17, then having to wait an entire week for that lame ass dreck ep 18??
Whew.
The chutzpah of Lynch to cap off that hour of dull, plodding, indulgent crap with the single worst "Nightmare on Elm Street" lame-o fake out ending since Sopranos. And that awkward sex scene between two people that are past the point of looking good naked (although Kyle's in awesome shape for his age, and I'm sure that was a body double for Dern) but still....bleeecchh. And she covers his face while humping him....so weird and uncomfortable. And since when were he and Diane a thing anyway? Remember "How's Annie?" I guess Frost and Lynch wanted to forget.
Now then. Episode 17 on the other hand was pure bliss for me. I loved everything about it. I even love how they used footage from FWWM and it looked like they incorporated some newly shot stuff (assuming they used CGI to de-age Laura.) And for a minute it looked like Dale was successful in changing the past and I was like "wow, the balls on these guys...essentially going back and erasing everything!! That's unheard of!!" But then...things didn't seem to go that way.
Was a bit surprised that Bad Coop was taken out by.....Lucy?? What? Whatever, it was cool. Also LOVED seeing Briggs again, even if he was just a floating head, and I for one absolutely loved the black BOB ball of evil. Way to go Freddie for taking him out with the green gloved hand.
Loved seeing Josie and the Martells (great to see this ep dedicated to Jack Nance) and having Julee Cruse singing at the Roadhouse one last time was just perfect. I knew she would be the last one. Didn't everybody?
So, if I was in charge, I'd have added that one scene from 18 where Dougie reunites with family into ep 17, had Julee sing....credits. Lynch/Frost. THE END. No episode 18.
It was pure trash. Boring garbage.
Still...I guess we get it both ways. Fans of the original show who love the Frost/Lynch dynamic like myself got episode 17 as the ending, and the pure Lynch fans got an hour of driving and headlights and stuff they like.
All in all....I liked the series. I really did. It was frustrating at times, but when viewed as a whole, 1-17 were really one hell of a ride, and I'll just ignore the snoozer coda tacked on to the end.
Also, I am perfectly fine with leaving the Audrey story where it is. She always annoyed me anyway, and she was unbearable in this series. She's in some kind of hell/limbo. Fine. I don't care.
And we still have Final Dossier to look forward to.
Bob.
Wow.
What a mix of emotions.
I loved just about every minute of episode 17 and then episode 18 was only slightly better than a visit to a dentist.
Whoever decided to air them together did the right thing. Can you imagine sitting on the edge of your seat, seeing that insane episode 17, then having to wait an entire week for that lame ass dreck ep 18??
Whew.
The chutzpah of Lynch to cap off that hour of dull, plodding, indulgent crap with the single worst "Nightmare on Elm Street" lame-o fake out ending since Sopranos. And that awkward sex scene between two people that are past the point of looking good naked (although Kyle's in awesome shape for his age, and I'm sure that was a body double for Dern) but still....bleeecchh. And she covers his face while humping him....so weird and uncomfortable. And since when were he and Diane a thing anyway? Remember "How's Annie?" I guess Frost and Lynch wanted to forget.
Now then. Episode 17 on the other hand was pure bliss for me. I loved everything about it. I even love how they used footage from FWWM and it looked like they incorporated some newly shot stuff (assuming they used CGI to de-age Laura.) And for a minute it looked like Dale was successful in changing the past and I was like "wow, the balls on these guys...essentially going back and erasing everything!! That's unheard of!!" But then...things didn't seem to go that way.
Was a bit surprised that Bad Coop was taken out by.....Lucy?? What? Whatever, it was cool. Also LOVED seeing Briggs again, even if he was just a floating head, and I for one absolutely loved the black BOB ball of evil. Way to go Freddie for taking him out with the green gloved hand.
Loved seeing Josie and the Martells (great to see this ep dedicated to Jack Nance) and having Julee Cruse singing at the Roadhouse one last time was just perfect. I knew she would be the last one. Didn't everybody?
So, if I was in charge, I'd have added that one scene from 18 where Dougie reunites with family into ep 17, had Julee sing....credits. Lynch/Frost. THE END. No episode 18.
It was pure trash. Boring garbage.
Still...I guess we get it both ways. Fans of the original show who love the Frost/Lynch dynamic like myself got episode 17 as the ending, and the pure Lynch fans got an hour of driving and headlights and stuff they like.
All in all....I liked the series. I really did. It was frustrating at times, but when viewed as a whole, 1-17 were really one hell of a ride, and I'll just ignore the snoozer coda tacked on to the end.
Also, I am perfectly fine with leaving the Audrey story where it is. She always annoyed me anyway, and she was unbearable in this series. She's in some kind of hell/limbo. Fine. I don't care.
And we still have Final Dossier to look forward to.
Biojex
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Ep 17 was the ending for TP fans....18 was the Lynch ending.
Scentless Apprentice
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Episode 18 was just odd. On the one hand it sheds some light on what happened in the first episode of the season "430" "Richard and Linda" "You are far away". Agent Cooper seems to know that things may change when they reach mile marker 430 when he asked Diane to kiss him. And this seems to happen between them during sex. Diane seems to transform into Linda about halfway through. But it's really hard to say when the exact time they shifted was.
Now Cooper, or I suppose Richard Coop, is on his way. He stops at a diner called Judy's and finds out about a second waitress. When we get to this house Cooper believes her to be Laura Palmer. We see a dead man in her living room. Though who it is I do not believe is important. We know that this Laura has also led a poor life. Another tie to the Laura we know could be the white horse figurine that we see in her living room. Note that she wears an upsidedown horse shoe, normally a sign of bad luck.
They make their way back up to Twin Peaks. This is just my theory, but I think this is where Cooper messed up. By crossing mile marker 430 he has ended up in a different time or reality. By not driving back to where he crossed he went to a different Twin Peaks.
The line about this all being a dream in Episode 17 could also shed some light on 18. If Bob was killed in episode 17, and Bob exists beyond our concept of time, then one might think that Leland never brutally raped and murdered his daughter. If that's the case then when we hear Sarah calling out to Laura in the last minute, it may actually be waking Laura up.
Who knows though. I don't even know if what I typed made sense. The episode was absolute crap to watch. It's only entertainment factor for me has been trying to take it apart after the fact.
Now Cooper, or I suppose Richard Coop, is on his way. He stops at a diner called Judy's and finds out about a second waitress. When we get to this house Cooper believes her to be Laura Palmer. We see a dead man in her living room. Though who it is I do not believe is important. We know that this Laura has also led a poor life. Another tie to the Laura we know could be the white horse figurine that we see in her living room. Note that she wears an upsidedown horse shoe, normally a sign of bad luck.
They make their way back up to Twin Peaks. This is just my theory, but I think this is where Cooper messed up. By crossing mile marker 430 he has ended up in a different time or reality. By not driving back to where he crossed he went to a different Twin Peaks.
The line about this all being a dream in Episode 17 could also shed some light on 18. If Bob was killed in episode 17, and Bob exists beyond our concept of time, then one might think that Leland never brutally raped and murdered his daughter. If that's the case then when we hear Sarah calling out to Laura in the last minute, it may actually be waking Laura up.
Who knows though. I don't even know if what I typed made sense. The episode was absolute crap to watch. It's only entertainment factor for me has been trying to take it apart after the fact.
Pixelpiper
Super Freak
Lynch took Showtime for a ride and had some fun with his friends in front and behind the camera. There's no story here.
Sidewinder
Super Freak
Sherilyn Finn seemed to get a pretty raw deal I thought. She didn't have any scenes with any of the original cast members and her entire story didn't really intertwine with the others much at all. We knew from other scenes that she had a son to evil Coop, so having her appear in the show wasn't really necessary. They really could have just mentioned her name in passing at some point, or not even at all like with Donna. I was surprised that Bobby and James played much larger parts in the end.
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Scareb
Super Freak
My exact words after episode 18 were "are you ****ing serious?"
I have incredibly mixed feelings about this new season as a whole. Some of it I really enjoyed and other stuff was just mind boggling as to how the hell it ever made it on tv.
I think if by some miracle this gets another season, I'll watch it since I've watched from the beginning but I think I can honestly say I will never ever rewatch this again.
I have incredibly mixed feelings about this new season as a whole. Some of it I really enjoyed and other stuff was just mind boggling as to how the hell it ever made it on tv.
I think if by some miracle this gets another season, I'll watch it since I've watched from the beginning but I think I can honestly say I will never ever rewatch this again.
Otomofan
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I don't usually give a crap about self-congratulatory industry awards, but I hope Kyle MacLachlan gets an emmy for this.
Think about all the subtle nuances he performed. You have Agent Dale Cooper, and Bad Cooper. Then there was "Regular" Dougie, (only in a few scenes) and then "Dumb" Dougie, and then there was even one last one, Richard Cooper, which definitely had elements of Bad Cooper's speech and mannerisms in him.
That's pretty awesome. My favorite Bad Cooper scene was the arm wrestling scene. I loved how deadpan and matter of fact he was. "It hurt my arm when you put it like this...I like this better" etc. Of course the tragedy of this series is that we wanted 18 hours of awesome, competent, confident Special Agent Dale Cooper, and we only get him in an episode and a half at the very end. Sooooo much screen time spent with Dumb Dougie. I'm sure Kyle and Lynch had a great time filming it, but man was it a chore to sit through.
I haven't really read any reviews or people's theories or anything. I don't think they really matter, especially for episode 18. But that's what I hated about Lynch movies like Mulholland Dr and some of the others; he's out there insisting it makes "sense" but he won't tell us how and at the same time it's all "open to the viewer's interpretation." I despise that kind of thinking from an artist. It's lazy and it's a cheat. Either tell a story or don't. If there's a meaning behind episode 8, at least give us enough to figure it out. If there's no meaning then have the guts to admit it was just an hour of dicking around with scenes and landscapes and things.
I went back and read my comments for the last few months and they were mostly frustrated. I knew going in it was very unlikely that it would be what I wanted or hoped for. But reflecting on it now as a whole, it was actually really close. There were 2 or 3 perfect hours of Twin Peaks television in there, and several more hours that can be cobbled together from different episodes.
After all, the original series got its reputation based on about 6 brilliant hours, and even everyone involved will admit the other 20 or so hours were crap. But the good episodes were so damn GOOD that they overshadowed the bad. I don't think this series was quite at that level, but it was close. It started and finished really strongly.
Episodes 14 and 17 were magic from start to finish. Episode 8 was balls to the wall crazy and even if I didn't love every second, I respect it. (I DID love the Woodsmen and "Gotta light?" Nightmare fuel!)
Nothing is ever gonna be as good as seeing the Red Room the first time, or seeing the insane brilliance of the season two finale, but there were a lot of moments in this series that I think came damn close. Would have been even better if they hadn't waited so long and so many key cast members hadn't died. (Or got old, wrinkly, fat, etc.)
I think I can take a step back now...I'll enjoy the official soundtracks that are coming out in a few days and I'll look forward to reading the book in a few months. But I'm going to wait until the inevitable bluray box to rewatch it again. I'm such a sucker....I'm gonna buy it for sure. OK, I lied...I'll probably rewatch episode 17 in the next few days.
Think about all the subtle nuances he performed. You have Agent Dale Cooper, and Bad Cooper. Then there was "Regular" Dougie, (only in a few scenes) and then "Dumb" Dougie, and then there was even one last one, Richard Cooper, which definitely had elements of Bad Cooper's speech and mannerisms in him.
That's pretty awesome. My favorite Bad Cooper scene was the arm wrestling scene. I loved how deadpan and matter of fact he was. "It hurt my arm when you put it like this...I like this better" etc. Of course the tragedy of this series is that we wanted 18 hours of awesome, competent, confident Special Agent Dale Cooper, and we only get him in an episode and a half at the very end. Sooooo much screen time spent with Dumb Dougie. I'm sure Kyle and Lynch had a great time filming it, but man was it a chore to sit through.
I haven't really read any reviews or people's theories or anything. I don't think they really matter, especially for episode 18. But that's what I hated about Lynch movies like Mulholland Dr and some of the others; he's out there insisting it makes "sense" but he won't tell us how and at the same time it's all "open to the viewer's interpretation." I despise that kind of thinking from an artist. It's lazy and it's a cheat. Either tell a story or don't. If there's a meaning behind episode 8, at least give us enough to figure it out. If there's no meaning then have the guts to admit it was just an hour of dicking around with scenes and landscapes and things.
I went back and read my comments for the last few months and they were mostly frustrated. I knew going in it was very unlikely that it would be what I wanted or hoped for. But reflecting on it now as a whole, it was actually really close. There were 2 or 3 perfect hours of Twin Peaks television in there, and several more hours that can be cobbled together from different episodes.
After all, the original series got its reputation based on about 6 brilliant hours, and even everyone involved will admit the other 20 or so hours were crap. But the good episodes were so damn GOOD that they overshadowed the bad. I don't think this series was quite at that level, but it was close. It started and finished really strongly.
Episodes 14 and 17 were magic from start to finish. Episode 8 was balls to the wall crazy and even if I didn't love every second, I respect it. (I DID love the Woodsmen and "Gotta light?" Nightmare fuel!)
Nothing is ever gonna be as good as seeing the Red Room the first time, or seeing the insane brilliance of the season two finale, but there were a lot of moments in this series that I think came damn close. Would have been even better if they hadn't waited so long and so many key cast members hadn't died. (Or got old, wrinkly, fat, etc.)
I think I can take a step back now...I'll enjoy the official soundtracks that are coming out in a few days and I'll look forward to reading the book in a few months. But I'm going to wait until the inevitable bluray box to rewatch it again. I'm such a sucker....I'm gonna buy it for sure. OK, I lied...I'll probably rewatch episode 17 in the next few days.
Sidewinder
Super Freak
I'll definitely rewatch the entire series and FWWM again.
What was the reason the man from another place didn't return for this series? It was a little weird that the giant and the one armed man were there, but the other one didn't feature at all.
The aging of the characters was really jarring. I mean it is 27 years later, but it really made you think of how much time really has passed.
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What was the reason the man from another place didn't return for this series? It was a little weird that the giant and the one armed man were there, but the other one didn't feature at all.
The aging of the characters was really jarring. I mean it is 27 years later, but it really made you think of how much time really has passed.
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Otomofan
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The actor and Lynch had a major falling out. Apparently the guy is a little unhinged and accused Lynch of all kinds of terrible things.
Shame too, cause I'd have loved to have seen him back in the Lodge instead of that dumb looking CGI tree.
Shame too, cause I'd have loved to have seen him back in the Lodge instead of that dumb looking CGI tree.
Pixelpiper
Super Freak
Nothing in this jumbled mess came even close to emmy worthy. Not a single performance included. You want to seriously compare anything acted or directed in this to the best of Mad Men? Breaking Bad? Game of Thrones? The Killing?
This was 18 hours of random footage and if you ask 100 people you'll get 100 different interpretations. Like building something from a random pile of Legos.
If you took all the decent bits from this broadcast, you might just be able to make a 4-6 hour passable mini-series.
This was 18 hours of random footage and if you ask 100 people you'll get 100 different interpretations. Like building something from a random pile of Legos.
If you took all the decent bits from this broadcast, you might just be able to make a 4-6 hour passable mini-series.
Biojex
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I agree. KM needs some sort of recognition. "It's yrev very good to see you again" I thought evil coop was a genuinely intimidating character.
Wow. I disagree with just about every sentence you wrote here. That doesn't happen often.
I loved this new season. There were things I would have liked to change. But ultimately this is the story Lynch and Frost set out to tell. I was let down by the finale too. I am still attempting to wrap my head around it. I don't like that Coop started the season lost in the waiting room and I don't like that he ended up lost in an alternate time line. I sure hope this isn't the last season. Lynch glories in happy endings.
*fingers crossed season 4 is announced*
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