Official "Ridley Scott's Prometheus" Discussion Thread (Spoilers)

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Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

You guys are too easy to wind up.:banana :D

Oh, I guess I should have had a smiley behind mine. I was zero percent wound up. Just that calling Blade Runner anything than awesome is silly. Certainly a person's right, of course. But silly. :)

I watched ALIEN today. I meant to see it before I watched Preometheus as I had gotten the Quardrology on Blu-Ray (the UK edition... it was a good deal), but I had watched it a few months ago so it wasn't a priority. But it's funny watching ALIEN thinking of all the "plot holes" that people keep bringing up for Prometheus. If you really wanted to do it, the same could be said for ALIEN and that's considered a sci-fi masterpiece.

I also found it funny that everyone was calling Vickers a horrible _____ for enforcing quarantine when Ripley (our hero!) does it in the first movie and clearly it's the sensible thing to do.

Also, everyone gets on the Prometheus crew for touching goo and trying to interact with the alien snakes when essentially that's what Kane does when he encounters the first alien pod.

There was an article about Prometheus saying it was a science fiction film that deserved a better audience than modern viewing audiences who seem more concerned with finding supposed "plot holes" than just enjoying and appreciating a movie. I find that a bit hyperbolic, but I almost agree. I don't think it's good to be that dismissive of people's point of view. It's clearly just not working for some people as they leave the theater and not all of those people are picking it apart to death. I think the reality of the film falls somewhere in between.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Oh, I guess I should have had a smiley behind mine. I was zero percent wound up. Just that calling Blade Runner anything than awesome is silly. Certainly a person's right, of course. But silly. :)

I watched ALIEN today. I meant to see it before I watched Preometheus as I had gotten the Quardrology on Blu-Ray (the UK edition... it was a good deal), but I had watched it a few months ago so it wasn't a priority. But it's funny watching ALIEN thinking of all the "plot holes" that people keep bringing up for Prometheus. If you really wanted to do it, the same could be said for ALIEN and that's considered a sci-fi masterpiece.

I also found it funny that everyone was calling Vickers a horrible _____ for enforcing quarantine when Ripley (our hero!) does it in the first movie and clearly it's the sensible thing to do.

Also, everyone gets on the Prometheus crew for touching goo and trying to interact with the alien snakes when essentially that's what Kane does when he encounters the first alien pod.

There was an article about Prometheus saying it was a science fiction film that deserved a better audience than modern viewing audiences who seem more concerned with finding supposed "plot holes" than just enjoying and appreciating a movie. I find that a bit hyperbolic, but I almost agree. I don't think it's good to be that dismissive of people's point of view. It's clearly just not working for some people as they leave the theater and not all of those people are picking it apart to death. I think the reality of the film falls somewhere in between.

Nicely posted.

In regards to Blade Runner wasn't that a box office flop and slammed by critics at the time of it's release. It's only recently that it's gained recognition for being a good film; 30 years on.
 
Re: Official Alien Prequel/Prometheus Discussion Thread

But these aren't plotholes...

1. The black ooze is a bioweapon. It mutates whatever comes in contact with it. Makes creatures bigger, stronger, more aggressive, etc. This was so clearly shown in the film. That's why the ship was loaded with them..that's why Janek had to fly the Prometheus into it. The Engineer was taking the ampules to Earth to exterminate us. Not a plothole.

2. Do you mean the Hammerpede? The white snake thing? Those were mutated worms. If you're talking about the actual trilobite, it was most likely Holloway's sperm. David infected him with a very small ammount of the ooze..he had sex with Elizabeth..perhaps the ooze mutated a sperm? Who knows. Not a plothole.

3. It wasn't an actual squid. It looked like a mutated sperm, and acted like I would imagine a sperm mutated by that alien goo to act like in the alien universe. What is a sperm's purpose? To impregnate..right? Mutate that with weird alien goo and what do you have? It's behaviour was very similar to a facehuggers, also. Hatch, impregnate, die.
As for the Deacon (thing that bursted from the Engineer), well, the Engineer didn't drink alien goo and have sex with the trilobite. Maybe the trilobite just acts as..a carrier or somthing. Idunno.
Not a plothole.

4. Speculate.

(

Excellent break down! Granted what you're saying can't be officially confirmed for # 3 but your explanations are simply great and make sense. Makes things easier to digest when thinking back over the experience. :clap
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Nicely posted.

In regards to Blade Runner wasn't that a box office flop and slammed by critics at the time of it's release. It's only recently that it's gained recognition for being a good film; 30 years on.

That is true. It grew on people over time and wasn't considered a classic until much later.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

I watched ALIEN today. I meant to see it before I watched Preometheus as I had gotten the Quardrology on Blu-Ray (the UK edition... it was a good deal), but I had watched it a few months ago so it wasn't a priority. But it's funny watching ALIEN thinking of all the "plot holes" that people keep bringing up for Prometheus. If you really wanted to do it, the same could be said for ALIEN and that's considered a sci-fi masterpiece.

I'd actually like to play that game. What were the plot holes in Alien?
Now... I mean plot holes, as in "things that made no sense", not "mysteries that weren't answered". My biggest gripe with Prometheus is that the 'scientist' characters made massive assumptions again and again (why in the world would multiple cave paintings mean the "engineers" made life on earth instead of just visiting), and that characters like the Captain came to conclusions "It's a weapon's depot" without having nearly enough info (he hadn't even seen the "weapon's cash" yet). Did ANYTHING like that happen in Alien?
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

The only problem I ever had with the original Alien is how the creature obtained a large size in a short period of time after shedding its nymphal skin. Again, this was done without any food sources unless the Nostromo's water supplied sufficient nutrients? That was never truly explained. From what I read in an old Alien magazine special, the creature's final height was 7'2" with no mention of weight.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

I'd actually like to play that game. What were the plot holes in Alien?
Now... I mean plot holes, as in "things that made no sense", not "mysteries that weren't answered". My biggest gripe with Prometheus is that the 'scientist' characters made massive assumptions again and again, and that characters like the Captain came to conclusions "It's a weapon's depot" without having nearly enough info (he hadn't even seen the "weapon's cash" yet). Did ANYTHING like that happen in Alien?
Captain Janek had been building up that theory based on everything he had seen. After he saw what happened to Fifield, he himself was certain that what he suspected was true.

It's not like he woke up from hypersleep half way to LV-223 and randomly says "Hey everyone, this planet is a military operation. It contains many deadly bioweapons."

This was pretty clear to me on the first viewing..and was just obvious by my third.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

I also found it funny that everyone was calling Vickers a horrible _____ for enforcing quarantine when Ripley (our hero!) does it in the first movie and clearly it's the sensible thing to do.

I love the parallels between Vickers and Ripley and how tragic it makes the outcome of the former. She did everything Ripley did and more. She halted the contiminated crew member but instead of trusting that the crew would comply and then have them disobey (as it played out in ALIEN) she suited up, flamethrower and all, and met them personally at the boarding ramp. If she was on the Nostromo everyone except Kane would have been saved!

There are other parallels as well, from her sleeping with the captain to hurrying to suit up and get in an escape capsule as the ship is about to self-destruct in an effort to destroy the alien threat. But did she float off into the sunset for being the most sensible member on the ship? No, she was crushed as she screamed in terror. That is just harsh to me, and makes ALIEN that much better if you watch it right after Prometheus. Because in that universe, just following the checklist of horror movie do's and don'ts does NOT guarantee that you survive. You can do everything "right" and if the chips don't fall your way you still die. The irony heightens the tragedy.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Captain Janek had been building up that theory based on everything he had seen. After he saw what happened to Fifield, he himself was certain that what he suspected was true.

It's not like he woke up from hypersleep half way to LV-223 and randomly says "Hey everyone, this planet is a military operation. It contains many deadly bioweapons."

This was pretty clear to me on the first viewing..and was just obvious by my third.

Interesting take. I would have just assumed a harsh environment with some crazy infectious diseases myself. Not clear why anything that happened had to have an intelligent-design behind it.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

The only problem I ever had with the original Alien is how the creature obtained a large size in a short period of time after shedding its nymphal skin. Again, this was done without any food sources unless the Nostromo's water supplied sufficient nutrients? That was never truly explained. From what I read in an old Alien magazine special, the creature's final height was 7'2" with no mention of weight.

Perhaps the original embryo was extremely dense and it's body mass was simply re-configured into the full alien?

Things like this (Alien physiology, alien motivations, even android motivations) I'm willing to suspend disbelief and assume that something is going on I don't fully understand. Human motivations or decision-making though - that should make sense!
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

I think it's interesting that the Space Jockey's pointed the ancient humans to the location of their weapon depot/research facility instead of their home planet. I also would like to understand the nature of the black goo a little better. If I remember correctly, the Space Jockey drank the black goo and his body disintegrated into the waters of what was supposed to be primitive Earth, which is where we come from. When did the black goo become a weapon? Was the stuff that was used to make us something different than the stuff they found in the jars?
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

The only problem I ever had with the original Alien is how the creature obtained a large size in a short period of time after shedding its nymphal skin. Again, this was done without any food sources unless the Nostromo's water supplied sufficient nutrients? That was never truly explained. From what I read in an old Alien magazine special, the creature's final height was 7'2" with no mention of weight.
I think the Alien was closer to 7'6"-7'7". I believe Bolaji Badejo was 7'2". Add the alien head and feet and that should up his height a few inches.

When I was younger, I assumed it actually ate metal from the Nostromo because of it's rusty, metallic colors.
 
Re: Official Alien Prequel/Prometheus Discussion Thread

And here I thought CelticP would be the defender for this flick and it ends up being Lar'ja Thwei. :lol
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Prometheus Plot Holes (From movieplotholes.com):


Minor Plot Hole: If we have the same DNA as the Engineers who dissolve in water on other Planets to create life, how come all the other animals on Earth do not share the same DNA?

Minor Plot Hole: After Fifield and Millburn are killed; the crew is clueless about the status of the two men. If only they could listen to the tapes of their conversations like the ancient NASA scientists did in the sixties for the Apollo missions. But alas, it seems the recording technology does not exist in Prometheus – unless it's for showing complex full-room holograms of an old-man pretending to be dead, or looking at HD displays of people's dreams. Yup, does not exist.

Minor Plot Hole: The Engineers are shown to wear elephant masks in their own spaceships on a planet they have no difficulty breathing in. We know this movie needs to tie-in with the space-jockey from Alien but this simply does not work. Those spaceships were not in space, they were underground and the air was breathable.

Major Plot Hole: God dammit. How can a 2012 movie still feature this old imbecile cliché of people running away from a falling building in length instead of sideways? Vickers ran in a straight line for a minute and Shaw only thought about doing something different after hitting her head on the ground. Her new concussion released her from the script's cartoonish logic and made her realize she could survive by rolling 2 feet sideways.

Major Plot Hole: God dammit. How can a 2012 movie still feature this old imbecile cliché of scared people trying to be cute to unknown terrifying species? In all the scenes of Fifield and Millburn inside the Alien spaceship, we see them scared of everything: especially the decapitated architect and super-especially when Janek mentions that a probe is picking-up life forms. But no worries! The life forms are just two giant alien-vajayjay-cobras straight out of your nightmares. This is why the p____y of this story, Millburn, goes against his survival instinct and fear of the unknown to try to pet the alien abominations. "It's okay baby. It's okay" He says. Great use of a rapist pick-up line to break the ice with an alien species – no way this will backfire.

Major Plot Hole: The alien octopus baby is responsible for many plot holes. Let's go over each one of them:

  • Shaw takes out an alien octopus from her belly. She lets him/her/it/wtf inside the machine and does not try to kill it herself or ask the crew to bring a flamethrower in the surgery room if they have a craving for squid rings with an after-state of placenta.
  • In order for Shaw to access the surgery room and make her own custom c-section, she had to hit 2 other crew-members on the head with a blunt metal object. Those two crew-members will 2 hours later join Shaw for another mission in the alien cavern and none of them will ever mention that Shaw used to have an alien baby in her stomach, that they were savagely attacked, or that they can't walk straight anymore since their brains started to leak from their nostrils.
  • Putting aside the previously mentioned problem of Shaw not telling anyone about her hentai-potent child, it is shocking to see no one did anything about it either. It could be said that Weyland maybe wanted to keep it on-board but he is still a dumb-ass if he ordered the crew to keep the squid in the automated surgery machine instead of freezing it and putting in storage like it was intended for Shaw.
  • How did the squid baby get so huge? It was out of its mother's belly for less than 10 hours in a room with no food and water but still added 1 ton of mass on itself – half of which being dedicated to a sweet new set of vajayjays. Did it assimilate all the particles in the air? That should be enough...

Major Plot Hole: The alien ship crashes and the engineer pilot has two options: either run for the next alien ship knowing he won't be stopped this time by an over-joyed suicidal crew or start to hunt for the remaining female human character that presents no threat to him. He chooses the latter. But how did he find her so quickly? Shaw reached the crashed escape-pod in a minute and the Engineer was already right beside her. It would be fair to assume the alien ship has its own life detectors and was thus able to locate the running Shaw without any problems, but then, how come the Engineer did not detect the 1000-pound vajayjay-squid right beside her? This gives us two new options: either the Engineer could not have known where Shaw was or he was stupid to not know about the dangerous monster right beside her.

Major Plot Hole: There is no way for Fifield and Millburn to get lost in the alien cave. They had an entire crew of people inside their spaceship monitoring everything: their dialogue, their positions – you name it. Are we to believe no one on the deck heard them say they wanted to go back on the ship? Are we to believe no one gave them directions to go back to the surface? Are we to believe the Prometheus crew simply assumed they were still with the others even if their scanners and probes would show they were not? Was there any crappier way to write the script to make sure those two guys were stranded inside the cave during the storm? (The answer is NO to all the questions).

Plot Contrivance: It made no sense for David to poison Charlie with the goo. He is the most advanced android in existence; spent two years guessing an alien language from snippets of old languages but somehow – skipped all the literature on basic scientific process. If he wanted to test the black goo on humans, he could have tried in a controlled environment in a lab with a sample of human tissue. He did the complete opposite of that. No one knew what the black goo would do. He infected one man with it and let him loose. How could he know Charlie would not transform into a monster in an hour and try to kill him? Or that he would not spray airborne viruses from his lungs and transform everyone in monsters that would have tried to kill him? David had his own motivations, but he put his existence in jeopardy and the only reason he didn't die was because of circumstantial luck.

Plot Contrivance: The effect of the black goo is all over the place and unpredictable like a diva on PMS.

  • An Engineer drinks it; it dissolves him in a river and creates life on a planet.
  • Worms are covered in it: they become giant vajayjay-cobras with an oral fixation
  • A geologist gets his face in it: becomes a gymnast zombie from Resident Evil
  • A human drinks it: make him impregnate an infertile woman with a giant space squid

It must be great to be a screenwriter who can pull so many different things from his ass: it's like your own personal backpack in-between your legs.

Plot Contrivance: A crew of 17 people accept to go on the most dangerous mission of their lives and are only briefed on their mission right before landing on moon LV-223 instead of before signing their contracts 2 years prior on Earth.

Plot Contrivance: Peter Wayland makes no sense. Why tell your crew you are dead? Why plan to go on a mission yourself inside the alien cave that will show to your whole crew that you were alive this whole time? Why bother? Since everyone wasn't briefed on the real purpose of the mission until they woke-up from their Cryosleep, why would anyone care if you were on-board? Senile much?

Plot Contrivance: Meredith Vickers, the leader of the Prometheus crew thinks she is half a billion miles away from Earth – even though that is roughly the distance between the Sun and Jupiter. Maybe you should start using light-years as a distance unit if you are in another solar system lady.

Unaddressed Issue: Pretty much everything that is not a plot hole is an unaddressed issue in this movie. Why did the Engineers show a star-map to their weapon facility instead of their home planet? Why were the Engineers running away from a threat to go inside the cargo room instead of another non-dead-end option? What happened to the other alien ships? Did the threat attack all the alien ships at the same time to make it impossible for one of them to escape? Why was there still one living Engineer inside the spaceship? Wouldn't the threat kill him too? The alien spaceships have been underground for more than 2000 years; did no one back home want to see what happened? Why did Janek not care at all about the 2 scientists trapped inside the alien cave? What is the purpose of those random pixelated flashbacks of the Engineer crew running? Why was everyone so relaxed about finding out the biggest revelation of human history? And why, oh why was there a goddamn flute to activate the alien ship?

I can answer the last one:

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*waits for Lar'ja Thwei to throw hissy fit + counter every single point above with explanations not seen in the movie to continue the fantasy in his head that Prometheus is perfect and teh greatest film he's ever seen in his entire life i.e. 17 years*
 
Re: Official Alien Prequel/Prometheus Discussion Thread

I just watched it again for the third time. My gf had to pass this time around. I gotta say - it's not getting any more cohesive in subsequent viewings. There are tons of movies that I didn't like on initial viewing and ended up being on my top 10 list as the direct result of viewing again ("Blade Runner", almost every single Tarantino movie, and even the original "Alien"). This isn't one of those. The inconsistent character behaviors are even more annoying the 2nd/3rd time around.

Also: there's a heatwave in my area today. And the showing I went to - the theater was only about 1/4 full. For a matinee showing in an air conditioned theater a couple weeks after release - no so good.
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Well, most of those complaints are things we've already gone over. :dunno

...and the rest are so obviously bias that there's no point in explaining them
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

I loved it! I loved the visuals, I loved David, the Sci-fi "feel" of the original movies.
I didn't over think all this stuff people are babbling on about.

Everytime I saw a reference to Alien, I enjoyed it!
The title of the movie phasing in, the written text explaining info about the ship and crew, the Space Jockeys, The robot, Stomach popping Alien, and the very last shot in the movie.

Loved all the homages to Alien, but didn't go in thinking it was a prequel and didn't over analyze. Great fun Sci-Fi movie!
 
Re: Prometheus - Spoiler thread!

Another question I have is about the life the engineers created on Earth. When she compared the engineer DNA to human DNA, it was a perfect match. Shouldn't there be some variation as there are variations between all organisms on Earth from monkeys to squids to koala bears to platypuses. Why are we exactly the same as the Engineers and those animals are not? Did they not come from the Engineers as well?
 
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