Will the PT be loved more or hated more after TFA releases?

[Prime Clone]

True, they probably knew he'd be a control freak. But at least he recognised he wasn't the best man to direct them, which was my point.

 

[DiFabio]

feels like there was another reason behind it, maybe they knew what a mess Phantom Menace was going to be and they didn't even want to bother trying to fix it?

They said why they didn't want to do it, it was too daunting. It was 16 years since the last Star Wars movie and it was a huge responsibility for any director to undertake. They felt it was Lucas' baby and encouraged him to take it on and get back in the directors chair. Spielberg and other directors were almost involved with Return of the Jedi.

A script is just a blue print, any of the directors Lucas had in mind for Episode I would have tweaked things to fit their vision. The Phantom Menace has good ideas, great concepts. For every Jar Jar "poo dooh" is a Ben Hur inspiration for the podrace, for every midiclorian type cringe was the Japanese influence on the Jedi and Sith order.

 

[WWEJedi]

Me and the guy from RedLetterMedia videos (I am watching TPM 1 of 7) would have a real nice discussion. I see his points. I really do. I just don't agree with them. The main character is Qui-Gon Jinn and his journey of discovering the chosen one. Of course his "test" is flawed. He is comparing Han Solo (three movies for the audience to get to know him) to Qui Gon Jinn. He is warping the "experiment" to get desired result. Ask about Obi Wan Kenobi (PT version) vs Han Solo. If he wants to actually do it right, it would be a character that appeared in each PT film vs Han Solo who appeared in each OT film.

This guy... now this guy.... is awesome. PDF at the bottom of the page.
The Star Wars Trilogy | The 108 page rebuttal to Mr. Plinkett's Phantom Menace review

108 and page rebuttal to that guy from RLM. Read it. It is great and right.

 

[RIDDICK]

I will continue piling on the PT when the mood strikes... I do this because I am a SW fan and the films drive me crazy that are as bad as they are and were able to ruin some of my enjoyment of the OT.

 

[JAWS]

Me and the guy from RedLetterMedia videos (I am watching TPM 1 of 7) would have a real nice discussion. I see his points. I really do. I just don't agree with them. The main character is Qui-Gon Jinn and his journey of discovering the chosen one. Of course his "test" is flawed. He is comparing Han Solo (three movies for the audience to get to know him) to Qui Gon Jinn. He is warping the "experiment" to get desired result. Ask about Obi Wan Kenobi (PT version) vs Han Solo. If he wants to actually do it right, it would be a character that appeared in each PT film vs Han Solo who appeared in each OT film.

This guy... now this guy.... is awesome. PDF at the bottom of the page.
The Star Wars Trilogy | The 108 page rebuttal to Mr. Plinkett's Phantom Menace review

108 and page rebuttal to that guy from RLM. Read it. It is great and right.

Comparing Qui Gon to 3 movie solo is not fair.... But compare Qui Gon to 1 ANH solo and you get the same idea... Everyone knew who solo was and he was a memorable character after 1 film.... Having said that I like Qui Gon... Much of that has to do with the casting

108 pages..... Hmmmmm I may just have to skim.

 

[JAWS]

I thought about this last night and it summed it up for me... You yourself even wrote

No. I stated the romance in the PT is corny and garbage.

Ya see... Because of that I could not buy into Anakin's Love for Padma and her dying of a broken heart.... I could not buy Anakin killing children and becoming one with the Dark side because I did not believe in the relationship. Because it was "corny and Garbage" I could not get into their relationship and thus it effects everything else about Anakin's motivations... Again... Lucas tells us they are in love but is unable to show us and get us to believe in that love.


That obviously did not impact your enjoyment of the film.... For me it does. This is what I have meant about poor writing, characters, acting, and ultimately direction.

Same goes for the Obi Wan and Anakin relationship... It is slightly better then Padme / Anakin but not by much IMO... Thus the other big story point in the PT is does not work either IMO.

 

[JAWS]

I don't know if I can read that review.... Fan Boy anger is all I see.... When he writes "Plinkett talks about movie "Protagonists" (annoying pronounced "Pro-toe-gone-ist")." He obviously just does not "get it"



Just read some more.... Its painful....

I am starting to see the point of the guy who wrote the review of the review of the review

" Sure, he speculates on reasons why something happens the way it does, but it is only that, speculation and assumption. Far too many of his responses begin with the words, "Perhaps", "Maybe", "Probably" or "The clear implication is..." For example, on page 37, this is his explanation for why the Jedi hold their breath and don't immediately start looking for a way out when the poisonous gas starts to enter the room:


Hmm, perhaps the Jedi, knowing that "dioxis" usually achieves quick results, and concentrating their psychic powers, detected that droids were on the way already? Again this guy tries to nitpick and make up another problem that doesn't have to exist.


Perhaps that is true, but it is clearly not a fact, it is just his interpretation. Good movies have little set ups for things like this, so that we don't have to wonder why something is happening"

the part I made larger is a big problem I have with the review of the review.... He is just making stuff up... Don't get me wrong I don't agree with everything Plinket says.... But this guy who is reviewing Plinkets review is making me like TPM less and It the only PT film I like....

I am on page 41... I better stop before I end up disliking the one PT film I like.

 

[a-dev]

So, please Dr. Rushmore, what is your diagnosis for people who complain on a weekly basis in every thread for ten years about PT hate? Anyone? I asked this countless times and no one says anything.

Pretty sure I gave that a shot in this or one of the deleted threads, you obviously disregarded it.

 

[Xenoburger_]

Pretty sure I gave that a shot in this or one of the deleted threads, you obviously disregarded it.

You did, it was a great post.

 

[fosing]

Pretty sure I gave that a shot in this or one of the deleted threads, you obviously disregarded it.

psycho the rapist calling psychotherapist.

lolz

 

[WWEJedi]

To have him confront some Jedi about his mothers death.. To bring it up... It was the only moment in AOTC that I find any good and was a much better reason for his fall instead of visions of his wife dying. He could have had a good argument with Obi wan about it and the dogma of the Jedi.. I don't think Obi even knows... So much for friends. I know he wasn't supposed to go out there but come on its his mom... It was just a chance for a bit more character building and drama.

That is a fair point. One that makes sense and one that I could see Anakin going to the council asking why he couldn't save/rescue his mother before her death.

I don't count it because he just lost the only person he ever loved... The killers were right outside the tent... And from what I can tell.. Sand people are animals who have no issues with murder... Thus as an audience member I don't really get bothered by him killing the woman and children.... I don't relate it to the killing of jedi children. It's still too much of a jump.

Not to me.

And there is nothing wrong with that... I was only posting why I did not like the PT. I was not attacking your views on it... Hence no insults in that post. I don't mind you arguing in defense of the films... But to call people entitled, idiots, and children because they don't agree with you was uncalled for.

It is funny you think being called entitled is an insult. Still. It is a very valid argument point.
I have been called far worse for liking the PT on this site.

And if you really don't like JAWS... That cool and it is fine with me. It's not going to effect it being my all time fav film.

Nah, Jaws is a cool film.

I thought about this last night and it summed it up for me... You yourself even wrote

Ya see... Because of that I could not buy into Anakin's Love for Padma and her dying of a broken heart.... I could not buy Anakin killing children and becoming one with the Dark side because I did not believe in the relationship. Because it was "corny and Garbage" I could not get into their relationship and thus it effects everything else about Anakin's motivations... Again... Lucas tells us they are in love but is unable to show us and get us to believe in that love.

I believe they are in love. It is just that George did such a terrible job at showing it. Terrible acting. Terrible lines. Terrible directing. I get why AOTC is hated. Although I do enjoy Kenobi vs Fett (both battles) Anakin slaughtering the Raiders and telling Padme what he did, then the Geonosis battle.

I don't know if I can read that review.... Fan Boy anger is all I see.... When he writes "Plinkett talks about movie "Protagonists" (annoying pronounced "Pro-toe-gone-ist")." He obviously just does not "get it"

There are parts where I don't agree with it. Then there are parts I agree with. At least you took the time to skim through it. Most comments on it the people never even bother to read it.

Pretty sure I gave that a shot in this or one of the deleted threads, you obviously disregarded it.

You compared 10 to 15 years of PT hating to my two nights of discussing why I didn't like three particular episodes of the Walking Dead. Sure, I wish they went in a different direction, but I gave the credit to two of those episodes of how they were still great episodes. Just shared what I would have done differently.

Maybe if I still complained about those episodes now and for ten years later you would have something.



Edit: Sorry if you did take offense Jaws. I apologize to you. I respect and enjoyed this conversation. You took the time to explain your points and I agreed with some.

 

[ironwez20]

Why do you love the PT so much? JW. What do you see in it? I loved Revenge of the sith and I think the OT is good but im a weird star wars fan, im much more interested in the expanded universe of star wars like the clone wars tales and everything before the original trilogy.

For me the PT is what got me into star wars so I kind of love them in a strange way even though they aren't good in any way. I grew up during the PT era so the games, shows, and toys out at that time is what got me into star wars, yes the OT is better in everyway I know but its the PT I grew up with and made me see a different side of star wars as I grew.

Is that the same for you?

 

[JAWS]

It is funny you think being called entitled is an insult.

Just a heads up... It is... Basically it means you feel you are owed something you did not earn or really have no right to.

Nah, Jaws is a cool film.

No... It's the bestest film

I believe they are in love. It is just that George did such a terrible job at showing it. Terrible acting. Terrible lines. Terrible directing. I get why AOTC is hated. Although I do enjoy Kenobi vs Fett (both battles) Anakin slaughtering the Raiders and telling Padme what he did, then the Geonosis battle.

We can agree to disagree here.. It's why I said it was not an issue for you.. You can accept being told that they love each other... But the lack of chemistry and the clunky way Lucas told it made it a very non compelling unbelievable romance to me.... And thus any actions made due to this relationship come across as false to me... I wish I could look at it like you do... It would help me enjoy the films a little more.

Edit: Sorry if you did take offense Jaws. I apologize to you. I respect and enjoyed this conversation. You took the time to explain your points and I agreed with some.

No problem... I apologize also for anything that may have been insulting... I like discussing this stuff... In fact it has put me in the mood to give them another watch... Anytime I discuss films... Even those that are not my fav peeks my interest in watching them again.

 

[Prime Clone]

Wonder what future generations will make of the saga, once all the Gen X fanboys with their raped childhoods have died off?

Future audiences won't have the baggage of seeing the OT first, but they may be put off by the prequels' weaker acting and directing. Either way they'll no doubt be easier on them than Gen X.

 

[K07]

Wonder what future generations will make of the saga, once all the Gen X fanboys with their raped childhoods have died off?

Future audiences won't have the baggage of seeing the OT first, but they may be put off by the prequels' weaker acting and directing. Either way they'll no doubt be easier on them than Gen X.

It'll be like James Bond. Most will acknowledge the OT to the Connery Era (with RotJ being the saga's "Diamonds Are Forever"), the PT will be the a Roger Moore Era (only folks who grew up with them will love them; others will either hate them or simply tolerate them), and future ones will guarantee stinkers are just a dud in a long franchise of films and not anything to be overly upset about.

 

[Prime Clone]

Nice analogy! Also I'm sure by then Disney will have a few dud anthology films on its hands too (not to mention Ep VIII or IX could disappoint).

 

[a-dev]

You compared 10 to 15 years of PT hating to my two nights of discussing why I didn't like three particular episodes of the Walking Dead. Sure, I wish they went in a different direction, but I gave the credit to two of those episodes of how they were still great episodes. Just shared what I would have done differently.

Maybe if I still complained about those episodes now and for ten years later you would have something.

Nope, there was more to my post than that. That's just the part you focussed on.

 

[Prime Clone]

So now that some (such as myself) are ranking TFA among the weakest of the OT/best of the PT, it might not mean any more love for the prequels, but people might realise equalling the OT ain't that easy.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Nothing will beat the first two originals films because of nostalgia. Most people alive today grew up with those films, so no matter how flawed they are, people just ignore it, and the new film, while not perfect or even great, it's probably a solid, generic, but still entertaining popcorn movie. Prequels are still bad on many levels regardless of nostalgia, and nothing will change that....if anything, the new film proves that an actual director directing the actors well and keeping things simple makes all the difference. Lucas messed up.

 

[Prime Clone]

True. The directing and acting in TFA are far superior to those of the PT, even if the scope and concepts aren't.