Star Wars: Andor (September 21st, 2022)

[Wor-Gar]

I like "I do it for the money".

I can't see a lot of girls wearing that one. Sure, they wear "Pink" and "Juicy" but they don't want to appear slutty.

 

[ZE_501]

I can't see a lot of girls wearing that one. Sure, they wear "Pink" and "Juicy" but they don't want to appear slutty.

They might if it's a sweet Diego Luna shirt.

"I don't know **** about ****" was pretty popular with Julia Garner from Ozark.

 

[Wor-Gar]

"I don't know **** about ****" was pretty popular

What kind of establishments are you frequenting?

 

[ZE_501]

What kind of establishments are you frequenting?

Many kinds.

 

[Wor-Gar]

Maybe a Syril t-shirt would work: No Prospects

 

[ajp4mgs]

100% AJP. I'm not sure this is rating well. Hardly anyone is talking about it in the media (or on forums). Of my friends who watch SW content, everyone has enjoyed the quality, but the conversations don't continue beyond that point. There's a lot of respect (and relief), but not a lot of buzz.

I've been blown away by the craft as well, but that last ep was when I finally felt it needed to kick into gear.

I hear ya. And I think you're spot-on about the relative lack of engagement. But there's two reasons why staying invested is warranted, and hopefully one of them will resonate enough with you to give it a bit more time:

1.) If we look at this first season as a 12-part story, then what we'll see this week is essentially the end of "Act Two" of a four-act story. This is only the end of the "plot development" stage. Compare it to ANH (which I think can also fit a four-act structure well enough), and we haven't yet gotten to Luke leaving Tatooine.

• ANH Act One: Introduction (establish the galactic civil war and key figures on both sides).
• Act Two: Plot development (meet Kenobi and learn how/why Luke will be the central figure).
• Act Three: The turning point (Owen and Beru die; Han Solo is brought in; Ben dies; DS escape wins the small battle).
• Act Four: Resolution (the larger battle plays out; DS is destroyed; triumphant celebration and conclusion).

Gotta see what this is building to. If it's great, the "slow burn" until now will suddenly take on new value and will be fun to revisit.

2.) If you have been dissatisfied with Disney Star Wars, this is the show you need to root for. If you don't want the same recycled plots and themes, the same incessant pandering with gratuitous callbacks and memberberries, and the same lazy writing with plot conveniences and contrived resolutions... then Andor *needs* to be regarded as a triumph in order to change the focus and methodology of SW storytelling.

I'm not saying that it doesn't need to genuinely earn your support. It absolutely does. But it just might happen yet. And *if* the payoff is a home run, then the fanbase needs to make clear that this is the direction to go with. Otherwise, you'll keep getting more of the same tired tropes and lazy storytelling that you've been dissatisfied with.

 

[The Buffinator]

I hear ya. And I think you're spot-on about the relative lack of engagement. But there's two reasons why staying invested is warranted, and hopefully one of them will resonate enough with you to give it a bit more time:

1.) If we look at this first season as a 12-part story, then what we'll see this week is essentially the end of "Act Two" of a four-act story. This is only the end of the "plot development" stage. Compare it to ANH (which I think can also fit a four-act structure well enough), and we haven't yet gotten to Luke leaving Tatooine.

• ANH Act One: Introduction (establish the galactic civil war and key figures on both sides).
• Act Two: Plot development (meet Kenobi and learn how/why Luke will be the central figure).
• Act Three: The turning point (Owen and Beru die; Han Solo is brought in; Ben dies; DS escape wins the small battle).
• Act Four: Resolution (the larger battle plays out; DS is destroyed; triumphant celebration and conclusion).

Gotta see what this is building to. If it's great, the "slow burn" until now will suddenly take on new value and will be fun to revisit.

2.) If you have been dissatisfied with Disney Star Wars, this is the show you need to root for. If you don't want the same recycled plots and themes, the same incessant pandering with gratuitous callbacks and memberberries, and the same lazy writing with plot conveniences and contrived resolutions... then Andor *needs* to be regarded as a triumph in order to change the focus and methodology of SW storytelling.

I'm not saying that it doesn't need to genuinely earn your support. It absolutely does. But it just might happen yet. And *if* the payoff is a home run, then the fanbase needs to make clear that this is the direction to go with. Otherwise, you'll keep getting more of the same tired tropes and lazy storytelling that you've been dissatisfied with.

Isn't this building to the formation/emergence of the Rebel Alliance? By the time we reach RO the Rebel Alliance is a recognized, organized threat that the Empire is determined to hunt down & wipe out, but so far in Andor we've just seen pockets of the discontent covertly involved in "illegal" activities which the Imperial Security Bureau (save for Denise Gough's character) sees as random, unconnected crimes. If Cassian is at the forefront of a successful mission that publicly embarrasses the Empire it would likely mark the onset of the Rebellion, as it would be the catalyst that emboldens others to join the cause AND would provide the funding (sector's quarterly payroll) necessary to sustain its momentum. If it plays out that way, I'd say that would cement both the show's and character's value for most SW fans. But as you've mentioned, it still has to be done in an exciting/entertaining way.

But what I've described still only gets us to the end of Act Two. My concern is what is the plan for Acts Three and Four? In my head we've already seen Act Four with Rogue One, so how do they both build up to that and end this show in a meaningful way?

/\THIS 100%/\

I really loved that droid though lol

But yes all that high quality writing, dialogue, aesthetics, tone and pace will be for nothing if we don’t get to see a stormtrooper finally land a shot.

Don't worry, I'm sure at least one or two of the members of Cassian's motley crew will bite the dust on this mission. My money's on Karis(?), the young idealist. They never survive for very long lol..

 

[ZE_501]

Don't worry, I'm sure at least one or two of the members of Cassian's motley crew will bite the dust on this mission. My money's on Karis(?), the young idealist. They never survive for very long lol..

Karis Nemik for being an idealist ... Arvel Skeen for being angry and untrusting; may go out in a blaze of selfless glory ... Cinta Kaz because she's Vel's girl and Cassian has the hots for her, plus she's a medic and reputed to be tough as nails; losing her will hurt emotionally and logistically ... not sure about the rest. Could go either way for Lieutenant Gorn.

 

[Wor-Gar]

In my head we've already seen Act Four with Rogue One, so how do they both build up to that and end this show in a meaningful way?

No show ends in a meaningful way, so they don't have to worry about that.

 

[Nagoya]

No show ends in a meaningful way

I would argue that the end credits for the final Book of Boba Fett episode were pretty meaningful.
Seeing those were the best part of the whole show.

 

[ajp4mgs]

Isn't this building to the formation/emergence of the Rebel Alliance? By the time we reach RO the Rebel Alliance is a recognized, organized threat that the Empire is determined to hunt down & wipe out, but so far in Andor we've just seen pockets of the discontent covertly involved in "illegal" activities which the Imperial Security Bureau (save for Denise Gough's character) sees as random, unconnected crimes. If Cassian is at the forefront of a successful mission that publicly embarrasses the Empire it would likely mark the onset of the Rebellion, as it would be the catalyst that emboldens others to join the cause AND would provide the funding (sector's quarterly payroll) necessary to sustain its momentum. If it plays out that way, I'd say that would cement both the show's and character's value for most SW fans. But as you've mentioned, it still has to be done in an exciting/entertaining way.

But what I've described still only gets us to the end of Act Two. My concern is what is the plan for Acts Three and Four? In my head we've already seen Act Four with Rogue One, so how do they both build up to that and end this show in a meaningful way?


Don't worry, I'm sure at least one or two of the members of Cassian's motley crew will bite the dust on this mission. My money's on Karis(?), the young idealist. They never survive for very long lol..

Great post. The genesis of the Rebel Alliance being fleshed out will be one of the takeaways of this series, but I don't think the main payoff needs such large-scale scope and implications for it to be a triumph for more fans. If Cassian plays a bigger role in the Rebellion forming than we've known about, then yeah, that'll have the lore reach to better satisfy some. But it's not even necessary.

One of the reasons why Empire Strikes Back was such a great follow-up to Star Wars has to do with shrinking the scope and making things more personal. In a way, the galactic civil war that was so prominent in ANH took a back seat for much of ESB. We got invested in Luke learning from a little green guy in a swamp; we got invested in the relationship between Han and Leia; and we got consumed by the connection between Vader and Luke. Andor can succeed in much the same way.

The strength of this show (aside from the aesthetics) has been world building and character development. It would be great to have well-constructed character arcs and plot threads converge in a way that personalizes the larger galactic civil war and reframes it for us with deeper context. That type of storytelling, when it sticks the landing, makes the larger framework that it resides within (the SW lore, in this case) that much richer. A reason to care. It's something that I think has been missing from Disney Wars, and why it'd be enough to end this in a meaningful way despite knowing that Rogue One (and the OT) is the ultimate conclusion.

We know where Cassian ends up just prior to ANH, but we don't know much about how he got committed to it (this show started with a search for his sister, and that won't be left dangling). We know where Mothma ends up all the way through ROTJ, but we don't know much about how she got there (we suspect that her family is introduced for good reason). And we don't know anything about what ends up happening to Luthen, Syril, and Dedra. A show as well-written as this can bring all of these disparate elements together in a way that rewards the viewer for sticking with it.

And, yes, it'll also need to bring this all home in enough of a fun and entertaining way to have a real legacy. But it doesn't need to go "big" to achieve that, IMO. Some genuine surprises when resolving and bringing together the arcs would help, but we just need an eventual reason for this story to exist. That can come by making us "feel" the struggle of the Rebellion and care in a deeper way than Rogue One did, as that movie focused more on logistics (Death Star plans, building a weakness into it, blah blah blah).

The quality of the writing and overall production gives us reason to believe that this is going somewhere well thought out and meaningful. Can it get there while ramping up the entertainment value? That's the uncertainty. We'll see soon enough.

 

[The Buffinator]

Great post. The genesis of the Rebel Alliance being fleshed out will be one of the takeaways of this series, but I don't think the main payoff needs such large-scale scope and implications for it to be a triumph for more fans. If Cassian plays a bigger role in the Rebellion forming than we've known about, then yeah, that'll have the lore reach to better satisfy some. But it's not even necessary.

One of the reasons why Empire Strikes Back was such a great follow-up to Star Wars has to do with shrinking the scope and making things more personal. In a way, the galactic civil war that was so prominent in ANH took a back seat for much of ESB. We got invested in Luke learning from a little green guy in a swamp; we got invested in the relationship between Han and Leia; and we got consumed by the connection between Vader and Luke. Andor can succeed in much the same way.

The strength of this show (aside from the aesthetics) has been world building and character development. It would be great to have well-constructed character arcs and plot threads converge in a way that personalizes the larger galactic civil war and reframes it for us with deeper context. That type of storytelling, when it sticks the landing, makes the larger framework that it resides within (the SW lore, in this case) that much richer. A reason to care. It's something that I think has been missing from Disney Wars, and why it'd be enough to end this in a meaningful way despite knowing that Rogue One (and the OT) is the ultimate conclusion.

We know where Cassian ends up just prior to ANH, but we don't know much about how he got committed to it (this show started with a search for his sister, and that won't be left dangling). We know where Mothma ends up all the way through ROTJ, but we don't know much about how she got there (we suspect that her family is introduced for good reason). And we don't know anything about what ends up happening to Luthen, Syril, and Dedra. A show as well-written as this can bring all of these disparate elements together in a way that rewards the viewer for sticking with it.

And, yes, it'll also need to bring this all home in enough of a fun and entertaining way to have a real legacy. But it doesn't need to go "big" to achieve that, IMO. Some genuine surprises when resolving and bringing together the arcs would help, but we just need an eventual reason for this story to exist. That can come by making us "feel" the struggle of the Rebellion and care in a deeper way than Rogue One did, as that movie focused more on logistics (Death Star plans, building a weakness into it, blah blah blah).

The quality of the writing and overall production gives us reason to believe that this is going somewhere well thought out and meaningful. Can it get there while ramping up the entertainment value? That's the uncertainty. We'll see soon enough.

Excellent observations. I agree Cassian doesn't need to play a prominent role in the formation of the Alliance, I'm just thinking that it may play out that way to shut up everyone who has said that he didn't warrant his own show. And it would segue into his RO role, where he is definitely considered one the organization's top agents in the field.

I also agree that the world building and character development have been the strengths of the show. I'm definitely already invested in the arcs for Luthen and Dedra. I find Syril incredibly annoying, which no doubt means he'll be around for the long haul and is destined for a bigger role in the Empire. I don't want any major OT characters to make cameos in this show, but if it means Vader shows up in Season 2 to force choke Syril to death I'll make an exception.

I'm guessing Luthen's arc will end in tragedy, perhaps in a heroic act of self-sacrifice to enable Mon Mothma's escape from the Empire. As of now I view Dedra as the character with the potential for the best arc of all. They've set her up as having the keenest analytical mind in her organization, yet so far her insights & instincts have been dismissed by those in command. While she's more likely to end up getting promoted and leading the hunt for Luthen, Cassian & company, I think there's also a slight chance that after the *** hits the fan that she'll have one of those "Hey, am I one of the BAD guys?" moments and join the Alliance, perhaps as a mole.

 

[Rotfish]

It's just that there's no "Baby Yoda" gizmo to hurl this into immediate pop culture madness.

That's why it's good.

 

[Wor-Gar]

That's why it's good.

Definitely why it might have more longevity. Those "cute" things tend to backfire over time. Ewoks, ET, etc...

 

[TheBatman]

Definitely why it might have more longevity. Those "cute" things tend to backfire over time. Ewoks, ET, etc...

Jar-Jar

 

[Bo Shrek]

I’ve watched all five episodes twice already. That’s something that can’t be said about any other Disney + SW. I think this is the first “original SW series” Love the writing and performances.

 

[e30ernest]

This episode was worth all the build-up to it. It's been a while that a show/movie has me at the edge of my seat the entire time. WOW!

 

[choombaz]

This episode was worth all the build-up to it. It's been a while that a show/movie has me at the edge of my seat the entire time. WOW!

Yep agree. Absolutely top notch writing, excellent performances, some great observations and Star Wars bits that absolutely were not in your face like every other SW ppty.

 

[jkno]

This is a more complex show for the mature audience, with developing characters and slower building action. I get that we might need the fast vroom-vroom & pew-pew from time to time, but this series is a breath of fresh air among the more clownish shows we get these days (not just Star Wars).

 

[Jmek]

Holy smokes! Well that was edge of the seat stuff, best episode so far and tense as as Tensey McTenseface winner of last year's Mr Tense competition!