1/6 Hot Toys - TMS 021 - The Clone Wars: Ahsoka Tano Collectible Figure

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I don’t think Ahsoka feels like a Mary Sue at all, she constantly got captured, beaten and failed and used Anakin's teachings to overcome the odds. Generally, we saw her fail, learn a lesson, then apply that lesson in the future.

I've never considered Ahsoka a Mary Sue. She often failed and learned from those failures. She developed as a character over several seasons. Her skills improved overtime.
She did some questionably op stuff in the last few episodes of TCW.
I don't think that qualifies as a Mary Sue though as this is her after 7 seasons of hard won experience.
Rey on the other hand is totally a Mary Sue.
 
John Wick does something OP = HOLY **** YES
James Bond does something OP = HOLY **** YES
Luke Skywalker does something OP = HOLY **** YES
Ahsoka does something OP = god damn Mary Sue

It’s amazing how some people drool over Starkiller and need a new game with him but then don’t like Ahsoka because she survives a fight with Vader and beat a weaker version of Maul. Ridiculous.
 
I actually like Starkiller, and I only know him from the books.

*clone(s) of Vader, created for a specific reason
*yes, massively op
*does interesting stuff.

What was the plan with Ahsoka? The Jedi Council decided this massively immature and impulsive latecomer Anakin needed a partner in crime? Really. Sounds legit. Its like Batman and Robin, but not as good.

Why create all these problems for yourselves, Jedi Council? Obi-wan must have been so annoyed at the idea that now he had to keep an eye on not one, but two scapegraces.

But its whatever! If you like Ahsoka go on with your bad self. Tastes differ. I'll admit that shes very interesting visually.
 
I realize that people just hoping to get an update on the release of this figure must be bored to death with this discussion, but I just have to add that while I intellectually understand the idea of “attachment leads to fear of loss, fear leads to anger , anger leads to hate” plank in the Jedi creed, this idea of training yourself to “let go of all you fear to lose” really does a lot to dehumanize the Order and makes them much less relatable and/or heroic figures. I never thought that was a good idea in creating characters and an Order that the audience is supposed to support at the very center of the story.

Then again, for just about every Jedi whose name we know, this was the first rule they broke! 🤣🤣🤣

Add to this that what are the Jedi if not the same child stealers and indoctrinators as the Empire and their Stormtrooper program? Whisk children and babies that the Jedi “identify early” as having The Gift within the Republic, train them to forget about their parents (best practice being to steal them before they even know what parents are) and force them into a life with (supposedly) no human connections. How are these my heroes?
 
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For what it’s worth, the Jedi didn’t forcibly take children. We know the Jedi identified Force sensitive children and met with the parents to take them and train them to be Jedi, but there’s nothing to suggest the kids were forcibly removed.

The Empire/First Order…much different story. There’s plenty of references to them taking children from their homes and making soldiers out of them. Most notably Finn, who says it on screen.

Not to say the Jedi were perfect, they weren’t. That’s one of the reasons I like Ahsoka so much, she was one of the people who recognized it for what it really was.

She and Qui-Gon would have been a perfect team, had he survived.
 
John Wick does something OP = HOLY **** YES
James Bond does something OP = HOLY **** YES
Luke Skywalker does something OP = HOLY **** YES
Ahsoka does something OP = god damn Mary Sue

It’s amazing how some people drool over Starkiller and need a new game with him but then don’t like Ahsoka because she survives a fight with Vader and beat a weaker version of Maul. Ridiculous.
Men = Bad ass so strong so cool
Women = Dinner and baby making machines
 
It's funny how saying the word Mary Sue can reveal how people thinks, but they dont accept that they are just a bunch of misogynists.

There is no such thing as MARY SUE.
I mean…no. Rey is a Mary Sue. There’s nothing misogynistic about that. She literally bested a trained Force user in lightsaber combat upon touching a lightsaber for the first time. She also apparently knew how to Force pull despite never once speaking to a Force user before. If she had good character development after that I’d forgive it but she goes straight into moving a mountain and jumping over a TIE fighter with minimal training.

And for what it’s worth - I thought Daisy Ridley was great. The character of Rey was one of the few I could tolerate in the ST. She’s still a Mary Sue.
 
Rian Johnson is your Mary Sue.
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For what it’s worth, the Jedi didn’t forcibly take children. We know the Jedi identified Force sensitive children and met with the parents to take them and train them to be Jedi, but there’s nothing to suggest the kids were forcibly removed.

She and Qui-Gon would have been a perfect team, had he survived.

Understood and agreed regarding the “stealing” aspect definitionally, but even with parent consent (and as long as we’re discussing it, what would the success rate be if some robed figures came to you and asked if they can take your child, make he/she forget you for the good of the Galaxy) the Jedi is still removing just about everything it means to be human from these children and replacing with this nebulous “love of everyone” idea. Just seems a little shaky to me.

But then again, I am QuiGonFishing. I guess it’s natural for me to question Jedi dogma! 🤣🤣🤣

And TOTALLY agree with QuiGon and Ahsoka. That could have been EPIC!
 
I'll get hate for this but I find Ahsoka an infinitely more interesting character than Leia.

Not sure I understand the whole Mary Sue thing. Heroes overcoming seemingly impossible odds and far stronger foes has always been a staple of cinema and storytelling in general. David and Goliath anyone.

Why do people only have a problem with this when it's female characters? Anakin was stronger than Obi Wan, Vader more powerful than Luke but both lost. Stallone, Schwarzenegger, Willis, Keanu etc can take out entire armies on their own in the name of feel good escapism but God forbid a female character do anything similar.

I haven't seen the sequel trilogy so no idea about Rey. Sounds like her character arc really sucks but that can't be said of Ahsoka.
 
At first, a very long time ago, I also thought it a bit odd that Anakin had an apprentice. But there was so little that we actually saw in the films of even Anakin's own training - not to mention the very small amount of development the Jedi got at all as a whole - that eventually I was okay with it.

If the show could add to these characters and the Jedi Order as a whole, then the era would be stronger for it. As the show improved over time, I was happy with the added world building and Ahsoka soon won me over as she grew as a character.

I did like her appearance in Rebels, and the felt her appearance in The Mandalorian was appropriate and properly done; sparingly as not to detract, But the point is moot since whether you like her appearances there or not would probably just hinge on how you feel about the character.

So while we don't agree, I do understand your opinion and appreciate the civil discourse.
Thank you and agreed!:duff

And I certainly can appreciate other peoples' appreciation for a character, because of course, if a person doesn't like, don't watch. Seems likes there's a lot of *vibrant discussion*:monkey3 but - for right now, I am just hoping since Ahsoka has her own show, Mandalorian is as rumored, and gets more into his character and Moff Gideon. Have no doubt there's gonna be some big crossover end battle show tho. :lightsabe

Sassafras, I like you a lot so please don't take this personally, but calling Ahsoka a Mary-Sue is the single dumbest thing I have ever read on this forum. Terrible opinion.

Appreciate that, but IMO an opinion is just that, an opinion. E.g. I get presented with a character and start forming judgements, like anyone. Like, do I wanna spend lots of dollars to have this on my shelf?

I'll get hate for this but I find Ahsoka an infinitely more interesting character than Leia.

Not sure I understand the whole Mary Sue thing. Heroes overcoming seemingly impossible odds and far stronger foes has always been a staple of cinema and storytelling in general. David and Goliath anyone.

Well, I don't, but the WHY is hard to explain. And people will see the same thing differently. Best I can say with a character is, does this feel natural to me, when presented with this character? It's not male/female. Leia, for instance, was raised as a princess, beloved, it felt natural that she'd be fiesty, able to handle weapons, and serve as a diplomat. Ahsoka is presented as a padawan to someone far too inexperienced to have a padawan IMO.

So that's a problem from the start, for me. Plus, can't get past the Anakin from the films, who definitely isn't, er, stable. Then there's Ahsoka, who to me as depicted, is too young to be a general for instance, and is just too nice. All of the time. Even when she messes up. Plus, she can't die, apparently. Even Anakin-Vader can't seem to let go of her. Filoni sure can't. And she's a massively talented fighter and can fix things too. Obi-wan looks to her for help. etc. The Clones love her. Then re the Mary Sue thing - Mary Sues often have some talented animal around. Check (the owl).

Overall, for me, because she feels like a Filoni princess character rather than *realistic*, like Leia or Cara Dune. Even Darth Maul seems taken with her - where Vader was perfectly willing to kill Leia, at first.

Actually for me Sabine Wren crosses into the MS territory some with her amazing engineering skills, but at least she was raised Mandalorian (fighting skills). And I don't feel like Ahsoka overcame impossible odds, because everyone always loved her, and she made friends wherever she went. It's not like she really FELL off the deep end and became a ruthless criminal or something, and then reformed. Which would have been interesting if handled well.

Anyway, she's just not a character I took to, but again, script-wise, think her introduction into CW was handled about as well as that kind of character arc could be handled.
 
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Oh bollocks. There most certainly is.

Namecalling people who disagree with you is a really poor look.
It's not namecalling, it's naming a toxic behavior, you must understand the things you think before you actually say it.

In fact, I'm even helping you out if you're not a misogynist, just don't use terms like Mary Sue so you don't get confused with one.

Luke and Rey training were similar, they were both helped by the Force to help maintain the balance(this was explained in the movies).
 
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