Star Wars On Blu-Ray

[demorathis]

There were plenty of films that came out in 1977... like "Death Bed: The Bed That Eats". Just because it was released then doesn't mean it will be considered a classic today. It has to be GOOD to be considered a classic.

Phantom Menace wasn't good. The PT and particularly the Phantom Menace fails on many levels. It in no way fills the spot that Star Wars filled in our culture (an epic, clever, humorous, romantic, nostalgic, innocent adventure during a time of increasing pessimism - told by truly talented people hungry to make their mark). Phantom Menace was poorly written, poorly acted and poorly directed. The whole PT was poorly thought out, particularly when compared to the OT.

It was pretty much entirely uninteresting and void of any charm, intelligence or originality. If it were released in 1977 it would have flopped, IMO. I know very few kids who like the PT beyond the space ships and toys related to it (granted, ROTS, while massively flawed, was somewhat more tolerable than the other 2, but certainly not up to par of the OT). There just isn't that visceral, emotional connection that the (now) older generation had to Star Wars. Star Wars had a MUCH more solid bond to (and impact on) kids and adults, and I think that the PT simply rides on the coattails of the earlier films without the emotional investment from audiences. Without the original 3 films, the PTs would not have much shelf life, IMO.

Sean

The Prequels are BACKSTORY.

They would never have exisgted by themselves -- they were the back story to Star Wars -- just like all movies have back stories -- the story before the story. It is natural that the episodes 4 5 6 are the stronger story because it is the the most important part. The classic mythological structure -- the Prequesls are the mirrors of those - where Luke made all the correct choices, Anakin did not. It's a good complement to the Orignial trilogy, but if you aill criticize it, you kind of have to look beyond the superficial style in which it is filmed, and study the subtext of the scenes - but overall the dramatic structure of the prequels -- those are solid story-wise and anything else is a matter of opinion.

 

[agen_kolar]

Makes less sense to me.

Shaw was how he looked when he redeemed himself and thus became, in effect, a Jedi once again.

Hayden is how Anakin looked when he TURNED to the Dark Side. Makes no sense at all.

From a filmmaking perspective, it kind of makes sense to attempt to visually tie the two trilogies together, but from a philosophical point of view, it doesn't work, imo.

If you want to get technical, I suppose the way you see it Shaw should be there...but bald, with scars, and missing his arm and legs. Shaw as Vader just isn't recognizable as Anakin, IMO. Hayden Christensen, on the other hand, is. I think Anakin died at some point in ROTS. At what point exactly, I'm not sure. In Palpatine's office, after the murder of the Mace Windu, Kit Fisto, Saesee Tiin and Agen Kolar? After the execution of Order 66? After the assassination of the Separatist Council? Perhaps not, as he was crying after he killed them. Perhaps it wasn't until Obi-Wan showed up on Mustafar and the battle began. Either way, I see ROTS as when Anakin died.

I don't mean to sound rude or argue the point to death, but that's just why I prefer Hayden over Shaw.

 

[pixletwin]

No, I do not. I repeatedly said "IMO, which stands for "in my opinion". Maybe I should have inserted it more. I guess I need to say IMO after each sentence I write in order to avoid your wrath. IMO.

Sean (IMO)


PS: IMO

(IMO)

 

[Entropy]

*sigh* I wish Adywan would finish his OT edits soon.

 

[SpaceCrawler]

The Prequels are BACKSTORY.

They would never have exisgted by themselves -- they were the back story to Star Wars -- just like all movies have back stories -- the story before the story. It is natural that the episodes 4 5 6 are the stronger story because it is the the most important part. The classic mythological structure -- the Prequesls are the mirrors of those - where Luke made all the correct choices, Anakin did not. It's a good complement to the Orignial trilogy, but if you aill criticize it, you kind of have to look beyond the superficial style in which it is filmed, and study the subtext of the scenes - but overall the dramatic structure of the prequels -- those are solid story-wise and anything else is a matter of opinion.

Yes I know they were prequels (back story). However it's not impossible to make interesting prequels. Especially with the talent and money available to Lucas and the subject matter which really enabled him to do anything he imagined. The flaws in the PT films were not the fact that they were prequels or back story, it was how they were executed.

You make a good point though- BUT I think there should have been a stronger contrast between the Anakin and Luke choices you mention- if there were that would have made things more (or I should say "actually") interesting. But Anakin was merely "impetuous"(mostly hinted at) and whiney until he suddenly made this utterly illogical decision to turn to the dark side and start killing children in ROTS. I don't see where this contrast was intelligently executed on the film maker's part.

Anyway- it's all a mater of taste as has been said. But few can deny the PT could have been better.

Sean

 

[Kabukiman]

Thanks for adding to our conversation. You haven't even bothered reading if you think it's just whining thats been going on.
Yeah more "cheaper deal" info would have been a much more interesting read...

Oh Star Wars section... don't you ever change.

 

[jimjimmyjones85]

*sigh* I wish Adywan would finish his OT edits soon.

And get them up to 1080p !

 

[The Josh]

Regarding what will be hailed as future "classics" in years to come I think its interesting that after audiences had years to digest both the LOTR and SW Prequel trilogies more people watch the PT on television than LOTR.

In 2008 when Spike and TNT aired the two trilogies simultaneously the SW PT averaged 3.4 million viewers per movie compared to 2.6 million for the LOTR.

Of course those stats alone don't declare one trilogy as "better" than the other but I think its very interesting nonetheless.

https://www.allamericanpatriots.com/48745646_spike-tv-scores-record-ratings-star-wars-saga

Wouldn't make much of it really. The numbers don't surprise me though to be honest because there are so many SW fans. They simply out number LOTR fans as far as tv watching goes I would think. Plus I think watching the LOTR movie need to be watched without commercials at all. Then you have box office numbers and LOTR has the prequels beat there.

For me personally SW could only hope to touch with all six films with how great LOTR came out.

 

[msjedi36]

There were plenty of films that came out in 1977... like "Death Bed: The Bed That Eats". Just because it was released then doesn't mean it will be considered a classic today. It has to be GOOD to be considered a classic.

Phantom Menace wasn't good. The PT and particularly the Phantom Menace fails on many levels. It in no way fills the spot that Star Wars filled in our culture (an epic, clever, humorous, romantic, nostalgic, innocent adventure during a time of increasing pessimism - told by truly talented people hungry to make their mark). Phantom Menace was poorly written, poorly acted and poorly directed. The whole PT was poorly thought out, particularly when compared to the OT.

It was pretty much entirely uninteresting and void of any charm, intelligence or originality. If it were released in 1977 it would have flopped, IMO. I know very few kids who like the PT beyond the space ships and toys related to it (granted, ROTS, while massively flawed, was somewhat more tolerable than the other 2, but certainly not up to par of the OT). There just isn't that visceral, emotional connection that the (now) older generation had to Star Wars. Star Wars had a MUCH more solid bond to (and impact on) kids and adults, and I think that the PT simply rides on the coattails of the earlier films without the emotional investment from audiences. Without the original 3 films, the PTs would not have much shelf life, IMO.

Sean

Hey that's your opinion that's fine. I disgree but hey it's all good. I strongly think that the PT would never live up to all the hype no matter how good it really is or isn't. I also think if the OT was released in modern times it wouldn't have the same effect the way it was in the seventies and eighties and would be shredded with today's media and critics. Not to say it wouldn't do well but things wouldn't work the same as it did back than. I love the OT as much as any 30 year plus old SW fan but I find myself defending the PT a lot. One because I like them almost as much as the OT and because alot of the issues people point out about the PT I see in the OT as well. IMO! The only perfect movie is Empire

 

[GreatFire]

Prequel Trilogy=crap. Fact. Trying to argue this is like trying to tell me 2+2=5.

 

[Rorywan]

I remember taking some kids to see The Phantom Menace. It was really an eye opener to see their reaction. They were blown away by it. They talked about nothing else for months.

It suddenly dawned on me that Lucas had done it again, but not for my generation. Maybe in 20 years time those kids will be on here talking about how a silly scfi movie changed their lives..?

 

[pixletwin]

Prequel Trilogy=crap. Fact. Trying to argue this is like trying to tell me 2+2=5.

You forgot to qualify your "factual" opinion with an "IMO".

 

[The Josh]

I remember taking some kids to see The Phantom Menace. It was really an eye opener to see their reaction. They were blown away by it. They talked about nothing else for months.

It suddenly dawned on me that Lucas had done it again, but not for my generation. Maybe in 20 years time those kids will be on here talking about how a silly scfi movie changed their lives..?

Thats how it was teaching. The kids loved to talk about SW but especially the PT and the way they look at it is how folks older than me that grew up with the OT look at them.

 

[Khev]

The kids loved to talk about SW but especially the PT and the way they look at it is how folks older than me that grew up with the OT look at them.

I did find it quite telling that when I was at CV 90% of all attendees appeared to be in their 30's with possibly their own children in tow to bring the median age down a bit. If the OT was so universally awesome how come it didn't impact anyone who didn't have a single digit age when they came out?

Where were the legions of 40-50 year old fans at CV, or even on this forum?

 

[SpaceCrawler]

You forgot to qualify your "factual" opinion with an "IMO".

In your opinion...

Sean

 

[pixletwin]

In your opinion...

Sean

Too true. IMO.

 

[Khev]

Well I'm glad that we established that everyone here has opinions about Star Wars. I was beginning to wonder.

 

[The Josh]

I did find it quite telling that when I was at CV 90% of all attendees appeared to be in their 30's with possibly their own children in tow to bring the median age down a bit. If the OT was so universally awesome how come it didn't impact anyone who didn't have a single digit age when they came out?

Where were the legions of 40-50 year old fans at CV, or even on this forum?

Right, I'm about to turn 30 and for me the PT had as much impact on me liking SW as the OT did. If anything it made me like the OT more because of how much I like the PT. Kids that I taught felt the same way when they would get me off track sometimes in class, before school, or after school.

 

[Batty]

I read it. Because what was left inside of him that was Anakin died when he looked like what Anakin did during ROTS. As I said thats when Anakin died his soul was just trapped inside Darth Vader. No, he was trying to save Anakin his father which he did by freeing his soul from the shell it was in. Again, he did that but Anakin died long before the body it was in did.

Well, we see things differently then.

 

[The Josh]

Well, we see things differently then.

Yup.