DiFabio
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No.
Everything the audience needs to know is explained in the Greedo scene right before it. The Jabba scene is redundant.
Original unaltered Star Wars Trilogy to appear on blu ray after all?
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No.
Everything the audience needs to know is explained in the Greedo scene right before it. The Jabba scene is redundant.
No. Everything about that scene makes the movie (and trilogy) worse. That's not hyperbole either.
1. Bad CGI
2. Repeats Greedo dialogue
3. Establishes Boba Fett as a camera mugging lackey of Jabba's instead of the self-employed badass indicated in TESB.
4. Han stepping on Jabba's tail makes Jabba dopier.
5. Ruins "what a piece of junk" reveal of the Millenium Falcon.
6. Ruins ROTJ reveal of Jabba himself.
7. Continuity error of Chewie walking in to Docking Bay 94 twice.
So yeah. It just pretty much sucks all around.
Bo Shrek
Super Freak
Only thing I like about Jabba in ANH is when he says "Han mi Booki"!! Face it is was only there to showcase CGI at that time and to tease the PT!
I like the fart sound Jabba makes when he spits the frog into the gong in TPM. Maybe we could get a little more of that.
Totally agree. Back in 1976, once Lucas realized he wasn't going to be able to pull off the Jabbe scene with the dude in the furry coat, he rewrote that Greedo scene to compensate what would be missing dialogue/background. Flash forward to 1997: to reinsert the Jabba scene suddenly makes the Greedo scene worthless and repetitive... worse even than who-shot-first.
I also agree heartily that not seeing Jabba in ANH was much more fun of a build-up wondering when Jabba was going to show up and what he'd look like.
Bo Shrek
Super Freak
What the SE took away from Jabba was this “presence”. I grew up with Jabba as a creature with stature you look up too sitting high up in his throne like a fat king. He didn’t have to move because he moved for nobody. I don’t think I EVER played with my Jabba action figure off his Dias. SE brought Jabba down to eye level? A creature that walked the streets with the common folk and could be walked on? I think SE made "my version of Jabba" smaller!
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Well put. I never considered that but it is very true. The threat was diminished. The fact that Han could "walk all over him" really undoes any threat this creature may have had based on Greedo's build-up.
Lucas really stopped having a clue didn't he. So many terrible decisions.
It does amaze me at times, considering how revered he was in the late 70's, early 80's.
Watching the entire unaltered trilogy again this past weekend I'm really reminded of how well the films compliment each other. ROTJ is weak in how uninspired the resolution of everything is but it has some real magic that it brings to the trilogy. Jabba, the Rancor, the non-CG Sarlacc pit that is borderline obscene, Shuttle Tydirium, Luke being a badass throughout, Slave Leia (obviously,) Biker Scouts, Admiral Ackbar, the insane Space Battle, the Emperor, Scout Walkers, and just when the whole thing starts to feel kind of "by the numbers" and like everyone is just going through the motions you get pure brilliance at JUST the right parts, namely the music as Luke goes off on Vader with his lightsaber, Vader picking up the Emperor, and the funeral pyre.
But when you start to add ROTJ elements into ANH (Jabba) and ESB (Vader's shuttle,) and improve many of the effects in ANH to ROTJ level or more then it really takes away from a lot of the dynamic that the third film brings to the table. In short it reminds you of ROTJ's weaknesses even more.
But when you watch them all as originally released ROTJ has just enough unique "specialness" that it really does work as a satisfying closure to the trilogy, warts and all.
But when you start to add ROTJ elements into ANH (Jabba) and ESB (Vader's shuttle,) and improve many of the effects in ANH to ROTJ level or more then it really takes away from a lot of the dynamic that the third film brings to the table. In short it reminds you of ROTJ's weaknesses even more.
But when you watch them all as originally released ROTJ has just enough unique "specialness" that it really does work as a satisfying closure to the trilogy, warts and all.
VintijDroidGutzz
Super Freak
Good post man.
That scene where Luke's standing there watching it burn with his back to the camera, looks just like a comic book panel - I always thought that, a brilliant moment.
K07
Super Freak
Great posts all around guys. I agree with most of the things you said about the changes.
I am one of those fans. But I saw and loved SW before the SEs came out. And most of you saw them even before I did. If I had seen and loved SW after 1997 and had never seen the original theatrical cuts, would I like them as much? Probably not. It wouldn't be the movie I watched and loved as a kid. Therefore I don't think anyone should talk about getting rid of anything. It's all apart of the film's history now. What's done is done. You might think it was wrong of George Lucas to tamper with his work, but he has and there's no need to explain why people shouldn't do that. I have no desire to own the '97, '04, or Bluray sets because the changes are mostly bad instead of good. But I do love the good that did sneak its way into the movie. Had Lucas really just given some of the special effects a facelift and didn't mess with characters, pacing, or trying to tie it with the prequels, would people really hate the special editions so much? I doubt it. They'd probably prefer one or the other, but I don't think they'd see them as the evil that we make them out to be.
I am one of those fans. But I saw and loved SW before the SEs came out. And most of you saw them even before I did. If I had seen and loved SW after 1997 and had never seen the original theatrical cuts, would I like them as much? Probably not. It wouldn't be the movie I watched and loved as a kid. Therefore I don't think anyone should talk about getting rid of anything. It's all apart of the film's history now. What's done is done. You might think it was wrong of George Lucas to tamper with his work, but he has and there's no need to explain why people shouldn't do that. I have no desire to own the '97, '04, or Bluray sets because the changes are mostly bad instead of good. But I do love the good that did sneak its way into the movie. Had Lucas really just given some of the special effects a facelift and didn't mess with characters, pacing, or trying to tie it with the prequels, would people really hate the special editions so much? I doubt it. They'd probably prefer one or the other, but I don't think they'd see them as the evil that we make them out to be.
Mad Old Lu
Super Freak
Excellent point this brings up. Like it or not, the SE's are now part of SW's history and it would be just as wrong for them to be ignored now going forward, as it was for Lucas to ignore the unaltered originals.
The (hopefully) new Blu Rays should include all the versions, like how Ridley Scott included all the cuts for Blade Runner.
And absolutely, if Lucas had only done cosmetic changes and did not touch anything that tampered with characterization or pacing or whatever, no one would have ever uttered a peep.
That NOOOOOOO in the blu-ray release of Jedi, what a **** you to the fans that was. After ROTS he must have known how much fans hated Vader having a tantrum like that. Goes ahead and puts it in ROTJ. Because it mirrors ROTS you see? Aint that clever?
sigh
Retrofitting the OT to match the PT, a bad joke. Well at least he had the sense to hand the keys over to someone else in the end.
sigh
Retrofitting the OT to match the PT, a bad joke. Well at least he had the sense to hand the keys over to someone else in the end.
VintijDroidGutzz
Super Freak
Wow - I don't agree with ANY of that.
K07
Super Freak
Wow - I don't agree with ANY of that.
What don't you agree with? Ridley Scott (and/or perhaps the studio) is smart. George isn't the only one messing with his work. There are four commercial versions of "Blade Runner" that I'm aware of and a fifth bootlegged version that was released somewhere along the line. Why isn't that as controversial? Because he (and/or the studio) hasn't held back any of the past versions. If fans want the theatrical cut, a version Scott doesn't himself care much for, he (and/or the studio) listened and gave it to them. If George Lucas (and now Disney) would do that, this wouldn't even be a problem. You'd ignore the alternate versions and be happy to own the original cuts you fell in love with. Just as some kid who saw the movies after 1997 would own the versions he fell in love with and would ignore the original version.
What's done is done. It's all history now. There's no take backs. If there was no such thing as the SEs, no one would go around and claim "Han Shot First." It's my hope Disney does release some ultramegaboxset now to satisfy all fans. You can have the cut you want, but you gotta get the crap you don't want with it
I'm with K07 on this one. The only problem has been Lucas's refusal to keep the theatrical versions out there and maintained to the technical standard that his latest versions of the movies get. If he had done that, there'd have been a significant reduction in complaints. I still would have facepalmed at his retrofitting to the PT and so on but I wouldn't be calling him a stubborn fool for forcing everyone to watch those and those alone.
VintijDroidGutzz
Super Freak
Well, I'm all for people liking what they want - that's not what I'm getting at.
I just feel that perpetuating an ongoing supply of those infected versions, is endorsing garbage essentially.
I just feel that perpetuating an ongoing supply of those infected versions, is endorsing garbage essentially.
K07
Super Freak
Well, I'm all for people liking what they want - that's not what I'm getting at.
I just feel that perpetuating an ongoing supply of those infected versions, is endorsing garbage essentially.
Star Wars is for everybody. It's not just for the OT purists. If the special editions were only released once in 1997 as some uberlimited release and never again, you could sweep it under the rug. But the fact is the original cuts were swept under the rug. New fans haven't all been lucky enough to see it. If they got the 2006 boxset, they probably would see that bonus disc as just that. A bonus disc. It wasn't marketed as the actual movie, it was something for diehard fans to watch and for curious newcomers to experience.
I can't believe I'm defending the special editions
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