General NBA Discussion

[Robopredinator]

Long as Bulls and Noah suck delute away


Edit: I love Chicago the city

Ah, still salty over the Cleveland dis? I have to say, I still haven't heard anyone say they are going to Cleveland on vacation.

 

[sarakawa]

According to you guys I know nothing and can't remember anything past the year 2007, but if you want to talk about modern teams/players forming "big threes" or "super friend teams" you can start with the 03-04 Lakers when Payton and Malone joined Shaq and Kobe. Then the Celtics followed suit by trading for there big 3 and then came LeBron to form his.

How can you blame LeBron for that practice when the Lakers and Celtics practiced it before hand?

I will answer for you...

you can't.

I don't remember the Celtics or lakers having a celebratory parade the day after their deals(before any games were played) counting off how many titles they thought they were buying into....classy Lebron.

 

[filip629]

Wow....some people's hate just make them irrational. I mean the same logic can be reversed without any real point for either scenario.

All things equal same coaches, players, team mate stats and opponents if Jordan or Kobe played on Lebron's teams would their records be untarnished......unlikely.

2007 Cavs Team vs Spurs 0-1
2011 Heat vs Dallas 1-1
2012 Heat vs Thunder 2 -1
2013 Heat vs Spurs 3-1
2014 Heat vs Spurs 3- 2
2015 Cavs vs Warriors 3-3
2016 Cavs vs Warriors 3-4

I split the series with Spurs because their one of the greatest franchises in recent history and I doubt they'd loose two games vs the Heat even with Jordan or Kobe. 2007 & 2015 line up would be a challenge for them to get outta the East but folks will use the "will" word so to make this easy they make it to the Finals. It isn't about how one grown ass professional man wills another grown ass professional man to perform but whether they win the series. I'm saying Jordan nor Kobe fair much better then James. Keeping the 6 league mvps, 9 all team defensive honors, points per game and per playoff with a record of 3-4 (heck assume the trump the Spurs and go 4-3) is Jordan still GOAT. Doubtful....

MJ wins at least 3 of the 4 Finals if he's with that Heat team. Would it shock anyone if he wins all 4? Would it shock you if MJ found a way to scrape out a win or two in the close games the Cavs lost last year and put his team in a position to win the series? GS wasn't the seasoned veteran team they are now. It wouldn't shock me. Not after everything I've seen him do over his career. I promise you he wouldn't be 2 out of 7 in the Finals regardless of ANYTHING you peeps say here. That alone makes him better than LeBron. Not to mention, his game was ALWAYS better in the playoffs than it was in the regular season. ALWAYS! That certainly can't be said about Bron. The one thing that MJ could always do that LeBron couldn't is score consistently. I mean score by the boatload. Score in ways that makes teams shake their heads and say how do we stop this guy? There's only one of these 2 players that has the highest scoring playoff average in league history and it isn't LeBron James. Do I believe he could do more with the same playoff teams LeBron was on? Hell yes, without a doubt. I feel the same way about Kobe.

 

[filip629]

Whose arguing anyone's greatness.....debating the stupidity around the whole subjective GOAT theory. Discussions can go either way....

No, it can't. At least not as far as MJ and LeBron are concerned. Come back with players like Kareem, Kobe, Duncan, Magic, or Russel and that's a discussion. LeBron isn't even a conversation starter.

 

[filip629]

What if Jordan was on the '07 Cavs?

After I took awhile to let that question simmer, my answer is I think not. Sure, he's more than capable of winning a few rings but I see one glaring difference in Jordan's game when compared to Lebron. When the stakes are at the highest and all the chips are on the table, Jordan couldn't do it without Pippen, couldn't even make it out the first round. He won titles because of guys like Pippen. Jordan consistently did and sacrificed EVERYTHING they had in order to win games. Regular season games, playoff games, and especially Finals games, but needed Pippen. That is something I don't see lacking when I watch LeBron play. Call it carrying a team or being rising to the occasion. I see it in LeBron being able to carry a team without HOFers. That is what I truly feel is the dividing line between LeBron and other Legends of the game. LeBron carried teams to the Finals without a great supporting cast. That constant maniacal drive, that consistent indomitable will...it is in LeBron's game when I watch him play and it was evident to me when I watched players like MJ, Kobe, and Magic play (just to mention a few). I don't see that changing anytime soon.

The day you watch all of MJ's playoff and Finals games is the day I'll take off your training wheels and let you ride with the big boys. I won't even make you wear a helmet. You'll be ready.

 

[filip629]

Long as Bulls and Noah suck delute away


Edit: I love Chicago the city

Not only do the Bulls suck, they'll continue to suck for a long time. I love Chi-town myself. See, we do agree on some things.

 

[RyanGabriel]

Just my 2 cents with this.

Jordan got Pippen and Grant via Draft picks and grew together and win the First 3peat.

Jordan, Pippen now a star signed Rodman at the time nobody wants due to his attitude. Bulls took the gamble
That leads to the second 3Peat.

Curry, Klay and Green all from draft and grew up to win the championship.

James elect to team up with 2 star players to win 2 championship
And now back to Cavs to team up with Irvin and Love.

Now saying this who needs more help of an establish Players to win a Championship????

 

[filip629]

I don't remember the Celtics or lakers having a celebratory parade the day after their deals(before any games were played) counting off how many titles they thought they were buying into....classy Lebron.

Careful, jedi might rename you sarakawa23.

 

[WWEJedi]

Careful, jedi might rename you sarakawa23.

The only time you post in this thread has been to defend Jordan. So of course you are filip23.

The hate LeBron gets is just pathetic. I can see some of you insulting him on Twitter.

 

[Darkseed]

Ah, still salty over the Cleveland dis? I have to say, I still haven't heard anyone say they are going to Cleveland on vacation.

No salt....I rarely venture up to Cle. Noah reminds me of a witch with bad hair ...... dislike

The only time you post in this thread has been to defend Jordan. So of course you are filip23.

The hate LeBron gets is just pathetic.

I agree the comments that stem from hate versus reality is amusing. In all likelihood he will lose again but saying the man doesn't show up to play in the finals is ludicrous. Plenty of stats to prove otherwise. Last year he lead both teams in all major statistical categories and almost won MVP on a losing team....to say he doesn't show up or "will" his team is baseless.

That said, In fairness Lebron has put himself in this situation both in Miami and Cle with his choices so I can't speak indifferently to that point. His choices leaves his legacy at (most likely) 2-5. He made the bed, he now gets to lie in it.

 

[filip629]

The only time you post in this thread has been to defend Jordan. So of course you are filip23.

The hate LeBron gets is just pathetic. I can see some of you insulting him on Twitter.

I'm not on Twitter or Facebook. Never have been. But your statement isn't surprising though because I've been questioning what you actually see (or don't) since you started posting here. And by the way, saying LeBron isn't as good as the GOAT isn't insulting, it's just a fact. You are taking it as an insult but at this point, I don't care why or that you do. Keep on keeping on jedi.

 

[jstep13]

No salt....I rarely venture up to Cle. Noah reminds me of a witch with bad hair ...... dislike



I agree the comments that stem from hate versus reality is amusing. In all likelihood he will lose again but saying the man doesn't show up to play in the finals is ludicrous. Plenty of stats to prove otherwise. Last year he lead both teams in all major statistical categories and almost won MVP on a losing team....to say he doesn't show up or "will" his team is baseless.

That said, In fairness Lebron has put himself in this situation both in Miami and Cle with his choices so I can't speak indifferently to that point. His choices leaves his legacy at (most likely) 2-5. He made the bed, he now gets to lie in it.

He has stats but they are empty stats. A truly great player will make his teammates better and I don't see that with LeBron. If anything, the star players around him have suffered trying to take a back seat to make sure LeBron is the play maker.

At this point, he's basically a glorified Carmelo Anthony. In all seriousness, what's the difference between the two? They both have amazing stats. The only difference is 'Melo has never had the supporting cast that LeBron has had. If you role reversed, I'd bet my house that 'Melo could reach the Finals, in that weak conference, if he had Love and Irving. I have no doubt in my mind.

 

[mikedanger]

I don't know what's funnier...WWE's crazy ass posts or the fact that he still gets you guys to bite on them after all this time, lol

WWE is Jordan level trolling and you fellas just can't wait to chomp that bait, lol

 

[filip629]

I don't know what's funnier...WWE's crazy ass posts or the fact that he still gets you guys to bite on them after all this time, lol

WWE is Jordan level trolling and you fellas just can't wait to chomp that bait, lol

"Jordan level trolling" I see what you did there.

 

[DinoDB1975]

Whoa, lots of posts since I last checked the thread last night. What happened?

Didn't LeBron pick his own coach?

And the only reason he gets "more crap" than any other player is because he brought it upon himself. The self-anointed "King" who has picked the best teams, chose his own coaching, picked the easiest road to the Finals every year has made his bed and now he has to lie in it.

I'm not sure that Lebron chose Paul Silas, Brendan Malone, or Mike Brown. It could be argued that he chose "Erik Spoelstra" when he decided to sign with the Heat. He sure as heck didn't chose David Blatt.

RE the self-anointed "King" thing, I've asked it before and I've asked it again....are we certain he gave himself the nickname "King James"? Again, serious question. From all I read, his teammates and the media referred to him as that in high school.

And you referenced my post, I did say a lot of crap he gets is of his own doing. Again, for as long as I've been on the NBA thread, you've been a Lebron James detractor. Which is your right. I don't take it personally. I respect your opinion, NBA knowledge, and enjoy reading your posts. We will just have to agree to disagree.

We've brought up different eras in this thread to compare players...I'm going to bring up the different era in this thread to compare the MINDSET of the players. Players on the whole today currently have more power than the players in our youth. Players can get coaches fired, force trades, and basically choose their own destiny.

The NBA makes more money than it did before, and consequently the salary cap has gone up. So a team can afford multiple "elite" players. Additionally, "elite" players can choose to take less money from a team, because they can make it up with higher endorsements. Back in the 80's/early 90's, your Alpha dogs wanted to be the highest paid player on their team. But with the advent of social media and the new economy, players don't have to be the highest paid on their team.

Different eras and different mindset.

One last anecdote I'll leave with, but one that can't be proven, as this was back in either 1997, 1998, or 1999, before ESPN's 24/7 coverage. I DISTINCTLY (and I could be wrong, but I'm 99.999% certain) remember hearing a report that Jerry Krause was going to trade Scottie Pippin to Boston for Antoine Walker. Michael Jordan got wind of the deal, called Krause up, and told him "If you trade Pippin, I retire" and hung up. Of course, the trade never happened. Franchise players can and will exercise any power they have.

This thread is interesting to me.

Yah, it is. If only I had the Michael Jackson popcorn-eating GIF easily available...

 

[mfoga]

This is still going on?

 

[DinoDB1975]

FOR ETERNITY!

Time is a flat circle.

 

[sarakawa]

I'm ready for game 3

 

[karamazov80]

Pete Maravich would wipe the floor with both Lebron and Jordan.

 

[mikedanger]

I think I watched that Pistol Pete movie about 100 times during one summer in the 90's, lol