Avengers: Endgame

[xipotec]

Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

So there are two Peggy's ?



Khev's twisty turny logic is the only thing that makes sense..

But I don't think that it follows the MCU rules. ​

No , only one Peggy. She married Cap after he goes back for her. Nothing changes for her really. She did marry and have kids, (with Cap) we just didn’t know it. Cap was the Husband all along....all this while the younger Capcicle was waiting to do all the things we saw in the films.

Essentially, there were 2 Caps living at the same time, one slightly older but living with Peggy while his younger self ran around in Avengers. WS, AOU etc etc.

And apparently dies as she did before.

Yes, but while he lives the rest of his life in the past, there's a frozen Cap too, right?

You got it now, and thats the younger Cap (in Caps timeline....)
No Evil Cap exists.

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[e30ernest]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

I think Peggy was always married to Steve too so we had 2 Steves existing at the same time throughout the MCU's run. It's not that different to having 2 Caps dueling it out for the scepter. When Steve also went further back in time with Stark, 2 Steves existed there too (one in the ice).

There are also a lot of examples in the movie where 2 versions of the same character exist in parallel at the same time. So it's safe to assume that Peggy's faceless husband was Steve all along.

 

[xipotec]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

I think Peggy was always married to Steve too so we had 2 Steves existing at the same time throughout the MCU's run. It's not that different to having 2 Caps dueling it out for the scepter. When Steve also went further back in time with Stark, 2 Steves existed there too (one in the ice).

There are also a lot of examples in the movie where 2 versions of the same character exist in parallel at the same time. So it's safe to assume that Peggy's faceless husband was Steve all along.

Exactly, except he really was not faceless, when Cap sees Peggy’s desk in the past, there is a picture of HIM on the desk in a frame....why would a married women have a picture of another man on her desk??? Especially all those years later?

The answer is simple.....that picture of Steve, was a picture of her HUSBAND....which naturally would be on a happy wife’s desk....




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

 

[Ropen]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

GOT just outdid Endgame as the greatest cinematic battle ever filmed. Not even LOTR topped this


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[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

No , only one Peggy. She married Cap after he goes back for her. Nothing changes for her really. She did marry and have kids, (with Cap) we just didn’t know it. Cap was the Husband all along....all this while the younger Capcicle was waiting to do all the things we saw in the films.

Essentially, there were 2 Caps living at the same time, one slightly older but living with Peggy while his younger self ran around in Avengers. WS, AOU etc etc.

And apparently dies as she did before.

Wait, what? One Peggy married a guy that Steve saved and she had kids with that guy, not Steve.

"That was a difficult winter. A blizzard had trapped half our battalion behind the German line. Steve... Captain Rogers, he fought his way through a HYDRA blockade that had pinned our allies down for months. He saved over a thousand men, including the man who would... who would become my husband as it turned out."

 

[ironwez20]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

GOT just outdid Endgame as the greatest cinematic battle ever filmed. Not even LOTR topped this


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Lol what? No it def didn’t. I could barely see what was going on and the ending was so anticlimactic. Lotr killed this

 

[Khev]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Wait, what? One Peggy married a guy that Steve saved and she had kids with that guy, not Steve.

"That was a difficult winter. A blizzard had trapped half our battalion behind the German line. Steve... Captain Rogers, he fought his way through a HYDRA blockade that had pinned our allies down for months. He saved over a thousand men, including the man who would... who would become my husband as it turned out."

Well if Steve survived then he was one of the men he saved. The man who would become Peggy's husband.

 

[jedibear]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Well, here's my two cents after seeing it.

Spoiler:

Initial impressions, good. I enjoyed it. While I was ready to see IW again pretty quickly, I think I can wait a bit before seeing EG again. IW had better pacing and the advantage of providing the set-up. EG was handicapped by having to wrap it all up and that gave it a bit of a "checklist" kind of feeling. The tone was more unsettled here and the pacing a bit clunky. To it's credit, the three hour run time didn't hamper it, even if the first hour or so did tend to drag. Now, I'm just going to wail with a stream of consciousness here with the impressions...

I loved the opening with Hawkeye's family disappearing off camera without the effect. Made it very haunting and immediate.
The interaction between Nebula and Tony on the stranded ship was great. Showed Tony's charm and Nebula's slow development away from the oppression of her father. In fact, Nebula came across as one of the stronger characters in this. We saw a good arc with her all the way through.

It really felt like Cap's movie this time. He had a lot of great moments It was neat seeing how Sam had influenced him with the survivor's meeting being a key scene. He really lead the team this time around and it was great to see that dynamic. When he viewed the old watch with the photo, it was clear to see where it was going, but it still worked really well.

Thor. Ugh. As many others have pointed out, what a disappointment. He was turned into that terrible crass party joke the obnoxious person keeps telling while saying "Get it? Do you get it?" to the point of nausea. The dude Thor was just intolerable and what made it worse it he never moved past that. Just wince-inducing, from the fake beard and bad extensions to the ugly belly that kept begging the question "is this CG or make-up appliance?" Shockingly bad choice.

Actually. most of the "humor" in this felt forced and flat. The boy's sitcom roots were showing a lot here with the crude juvenile remarks...it really disrupted the tone without really adding anything but cheap laughs.

The merged Hulk. It too was wince-inducing and too- cute at times, but at least there was some character moments with it that made sense and moved him forward. I actually enjoyed his scene with the Ancient One...both characters worked well there. It was a weird choice not to have a big "hulk out" moment with Thanos where Hulk gets the upper hand, especially after what happened in IW but maybe the boys thought that would be too obvious.

Black Widow. Well, now we know that standalone movie has got to be a prequel. What a wasted death. No impact, especially when the concept is "sacrifice what you love"...it felt stretched and contrived..the character deserved so much better. It was like these guys never really knew what to do with her in these stories so just kill her off and be done with it. Her absence was really front and center during the final battle when the "girl power" line-up had their moment.

Thanos. With so much focus on him in IW, it was sad to see him seem more like a stock villain here. He had one great scene at the end with that look of genuine bewilderment as he met his fate.

CM. Who? Oh her...never mind. And a side note: Zoe should get best actress just for kicking Pratt in the nuts. Something I've always wanted to do. GREAT moment.

One sad part of the "wrap it up" nature of the movie is so many characters really were nothing more than glorified cameos.

Time travel. HATE IT. SICK OF IT. It's the "it" story crutch this year...Star Trek Discovery used it to worm it's way out it's original premise and now EG uses it to get out of the big corner IW left everything in. The whole jabberfest explaining it (or not?) was pointless and sucked any sense of consequence out of the proceedings. The only sure story quality it adds is the endless point of debate it creates. Not interesting, not good story telling., just a lazy way of getting away with whatever they want to do. I hate time travel. Wouldn't be surprised if we don't see it in SW later this year. If there is one thing we know about Disney is...they'll beat an idea to death if it will make them another dime.

The CGI stew for the finale. And this is it. I'm marveled out. I'll see this again before it leaves the screen, but it feels like enough of an end where it's as good a place as any to bow out on these.

My attraction to these Marvel movies has always been the ones that felt more "real world". Hyper-real, yes, but grounded. The original Iron Man, CA:TFA and still my personal favorite, CA:WS are the ones I'll come back to. (I could throw BP in there too). But when the movies and characters moved into the mystical, the out-of-this-world and the heavy fantasy, I felt less invested. I had to see this movie...it's the end of the story. The arcs that worked the best for me were Cap and Tony. The final battle was just this giant CG cluster****** where there wasn't any real weight to anything and nothing look real or impactful. Where there cool moments? Hell yeah! Seeing Cap wield the hammer in battle while Thor looks on admiringly was awesome...the glorious full screen shot of all the heroes emerging from the protals looked like the ultimate two-page spread in the biggest comic ever. It was cool.

But it was that last scene with Cap passing the shield to Falcon that just rocked it for me. With Bucky looking on proudly, Sam accepts the mantle with grace and dignity. That moment worked despite the worst old age make-up (or CG) to ever grace the screen. And that final moment with Cap and Peggy? Wonderful....as long a you turn the brain off to how he got there and just enjoy it.

That could actually be the coda for this movie. Just jump in, tune out and enjoy the moments.

That's my two cents....

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Well if Steve survived then he was one of the men he saved. The man who would become Peggy's husband.

This is an interesting quote.

"Carter recounted her husband's war experience during an interview in 1953, stating that "even after he died, Steve was still changing my life"

 

[Rotfish]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Might've been mentioned before, but who here thinks the Black Widow movie will be about

Spoiler:

Budapest? They've referenced it so many times and Endgame ties up every other loose end for the living Avengers. Why not fill in the blanks in BW's background with this clearly important event now that she's dead?

 

[Khev]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Might've been mentioned before, but who here thinks the Black Widow movie will be about

Spoiler:

Budapest? They've referenced it so many times and Endgame ties up every other loose end for the living Avengers. Why not fill in the blanks in BW's background with this clearly important event now that she's dead?

No kidding huh. I'm almost surprised it wasn't her last word. Turns out to be a sled with space aliens painted on the side, lol.

 

[Star-Crunch]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Might've been mentioned before, but who here thinks the Black Widow movie will be about

Spoiler:

Budapest? They've referenced it so many times and Endgame ties up every other loose end for the living Avengers. Why not fill in the blanks in BW's background with this clearly important event now that she's dead?

Spoiler:

Personally, I hope not. It’s one of those things that I think should be left to the imagination. Just like how the kessel run didn’t need to be spelled out for us.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

why would a married women have a picture of another man on her desk??? Especially all those years later?

Wasn't Cap/Steve's death the whole motivation behind SHIELD? He was like an unofficial founder of Shield.

 

[moose]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Might've been mentioned before, but who here thinks the Black Widow movie will be about

Spoiler:

Budapest? They've referenced it so many times and Endgame ties up every other loose end for the living Avengers. Why not fill in the blanks in BW's background with this clearly important event now that she's dead?

yeah it might be another team up movie

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[JAWS]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

The article explained all that. You didn't read it.

I did read it.. I did not agree with its logic when it came to this film.. It does not add up.

Did your precious article explain how there could be an alternate timeline Cap that appeared back in the first timeline as an old man? Hmm, HMMM? So that means he got together with the same Peggy who had been married in her youth. Either to Steve himself or another man that could have died before Steve.

This

Yeah but if you take the MCU films as all being one strung together "reality" then in that one reality Peggy was married at least as far back as the 50's. And old man Steve exists at the tail end of that reality having assumedly also married her (based on his ring and flashback to the dance.) So she either was married to two men, or she was married to one man who was replaced by Steve, or she was always married to Steve. I don't see any way around one of those scenarios being true given what's shown on screen.

So I pick "it was always Steve." But your mileage may vary.

and this..

Russo's came up with an idea so anything goes.. Its dumb but fun.

 

[JAWS]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Exactly, except he really was not faceless, when Cap sees Peggy’s desk in the past, there is a picture of HIM on the desk in a frame....why would a married women have a picture of another man on her desk??? Especially all those years later?

The answer is simple.....that picture of Steve, was a picture of her HUSBAND....which naturally would be on a happy wife’s desk....




Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

Yes.. Nothing like hiding the fact you are married to Steve Rogers by putting a pic of him on your desk...

That reality did not happen yet.. The past is the future and the future is the past.. Per Dr Banner... She would not have a pic of Cap as her Husband until he went back in time... With this films logic the pic would be from the "timeline" Future.

 

[JAWS]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

No , only one Peggy. She married Cap after he goes back for her. Nothing changes for her really. She did marry and have kids, (with Cap) we just didn’t know it. Cap was the Husband all along....all this while the younger Capcicle was waiting to do all the things we saw in the films.

Essentially, there were 2 Caps living at the same time, one slightly older but living with Peggy while his younger self ran around in Avengers. WS, AOU etc etc.

And apparently dies as she did before.



You got it now, and thats the younger Cap (in Caps timeline....)
No Evil Cap exists.

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

Again this cant work... The past becomes caps Future and his present becomes the past..

Basically its either an alternate timeline... AKA Evil Cap gets rid of Husband and kids

Or its just a stuoid movie.

 

[JAWS]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

You got it now, and thats the younger Cap (in Caps timeline....)
No Evil Cap exists.

Sent from the inside of a giant slug in outer space.....

I do agree that there would have to be two Caps.. But I don't agree that she was always married to him...


Caps life is on one straight path.... Going back to the past is still his life and it is the future. It never happens until it happens.. So Peggy does not get married to Cap as he had not been able to time travel yet..

He goes back in time.. Kills Peggy's husband and kids and lives Happily ever after.

 

[ShadowX81]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Or they're just all polygamousts and living in sin.

 

[JAWS]

Re: Avengers: Endgame (April 26th, 2019)

Or they're just all polygamousts and living in sin.

There it is.. You figured it out.