If designs are based off the actors own face would Mara Jade be based off her models?

[Agent0028]

Yeah, you're right Luke is very monk-like at the end of ROTJ, and I will criticize about the EU that him having girlfriends all the time was lame, but I don't think him eventually getting married and having a child is wrong. Things happen, I'm not the same person I was 10 years ago. I think alot of Star Wars characters changed their character trajectories within the movies.

The hot chocolate doesn't bother me because sometimes I like something familiar as opposed to coming up with something new that we know what it is. Like caf instead of coffee. Just call it coffee.

As for what I dislike about the EU...I didn't like how many friggin' weapons of super mass destruction there were. There were quite a few novels were there was a new one every few years that they discovered. Also I agree with Anzik and your point about some of the books being alot more Sci-Fi with Star Wars characters than true Star Wars. I really disliked Luke Skywalker and the Shadows of Mindor for that reason.

The bottom line for me is that Star Wars is a form of escape. It let's me get away from the bull____ that I am dealing with in my own life and takes me to a place where people can fly sapceships, fight with laser swords, and do cool ____ with their minds. So it is fun to have new ideas (well sorta), characters, and plots to follow instead of watching the movies for the millionth time.

 

[Agent0028]

It goes against the original PT ideal that is why. Originally Jedis were supposed to be practically monks, Samurai, leaving all things aside to pay attention to the higher order. You have to remember that before the PT, Luke Skywalker was the Last of the Jedi, the chosen one and having him decide that he'll go against the traditional views of those in an act of servititude by having kids, a wife and hot chocolate waters down the character and the Jedi order. Even Lucas going back through the PT made Anakin having a wife and children outlawed which is why Anakin and Padme had to keep it a secret. Being a Jedi back when the PT solely existed even back to Zahn's first novel was a sacrifice to the greater good.

OT Jedi = Monks/Samurai
PT Jedi = Intergalactic Police Squad

I don't particularly have a problem with Luke getting married, etc but I definitely understand how it goes against what Lucas set up through the first three films.



Could have been worse....Ben Skywalker (Funny that he named him Ben in retrospect since his name was actually Obi-Wan...) could have been sparkly, full of angst and using his Jedi abilities to impress the girl in his biology class...

The problem with that is that Luke's romance with Mara started long before we knew Jedi weren't supposed to have attachments. At least I don't remember that being anywhere in the OT. Hell, it isn't even in TPM, iirc. Personally, I thought that entire idea was more contrived by Lucas in order to have a Romeo and Juliet relationship between Anakin and Padme.

I like your point about the OT jedi ideal vs. the PT. Especially since being an intergalactic peace squad is what brought about their fall.

I guess some of it is hard for me to distinguish because I saw the movies then started reading the books about a year later. I never had all those years of building what OT Jedi were like. And it was only a few short years after that when the PT came about.

 

[IrishJedi]

The bottom line for me is that Star Wars is a form of escape. It let's me get away from the bull____ that I am dealing with in my own life and takes me to a place where people can fly sapceships, fight with laser swords, and do cool ____ with their minds. So it is fun to have new ideas (well sorta), characters, and plots to follow instead of watching the movies for the millionth time.

Hey, nothing wrong with that, bro.

 

[The Josh]

The bottom line for me is that Star Wars is a form of escape. It let's me get away from the bull____ that I am dealing with in my own life and takes me to a place where people can fly sapceships, fight with laser swords, and do cool ____ with their minds. So it is fun to have new ideas (well sorta), characters, and plots to follow instead of watching the movies for the millionth time.

I feel the same. Some of it is just really odd and some really good. Same way with the movies themselves. In the end I use it as a way to get away. I like talking about it and even debating it but I just can't get so serious about something not serious.

 

[Agent0028]

Hey, nothing wrong with that, bro.

I know, that's why I don't mind making comments in reply to yours. I know you don't take it personally and you're level headed and can back up your opinions. Even if they are wrong.

 

[IrishJedi]

Wrong???! Why you...

 

[The Josh]

I know, that's why I don't mind making comments in reply to yours. I know you don't take it personally and you're level headed and can back up your opinions. Even if they are wrong.

Don't start talking nice about Carl. He'll think we like him.

 

[Agent0028]

I'm just being nice to his face, once he leaves the thread I'll trash talk him.

 

[IrishJedi]

Don't start talking nice about Carl. He'll think we like him.

 

[The Josh]

I'm just being nice to his face, once he leaves the thread I'll trash talk him.

You're learning quickly.

That second doesn't looks so good.

 

[IdeaOfEvil]

I'd like to weigh in on the whole "Jedis aren't supposed to get married" debate.

George Lucas is a terrible writer. I could care less when people tell me "If Lucas didn't say/do it, it isn't official canon" because Star Wars was only Expanded Universe for the 16 years between RotJ and TPM and that was what kept Star Wars so fresh in peoples minds who were hungering for a new movie. Go ahead and say what you will, but just cuz Lucas cherry picks certain things out of the Expanded Universe (like the name for Corruscant from the first novels) doesn't make them any better than what he didn't. Hell, the PT mixed with his OT edits just showed me how horrible of a person he is and how Star Wars is really 70% all about the Expanded Universe more than Georges terrible ideas.

So, when it comes to Luke getting married, I'm all for it. If you knew much about his relationship with Mara, you'd know he didn't marry her until they were well into their mid 30s and they didn't have their first, and only, kid until their mid 40s.

I could accept the whole thing about Jedis not being allowed to love, or whatever, if Gary Kurtz would have had his way with RotJ and Luke going off to become something of a hermit like Obi-Wan, but AGAIN it was idiotic Lucas that turned that film into the pos it was. And even still the forbidden love stuff was written relatively recently, long after anything the EU had ever written, and we're expected to think that it's garbage writing because Lucas deems it so afterwards?

Sorry, Lucas is a great business man and owns Star Wars, but the creative force that created everything behind it belongs to the hundreds of people he hired to do the thinking for him (pre-edits at least)

 

[lerath666]

summing up entire thread.


WAAHHHHHHHHH! if it's not a movie it's BAD!
If sideshow makes EU figures no one will buy them and then Ill not get the figures I want! And what I want is Right and everyone else should want it toooo!


Ok, that's a bit of an exaggeration, ( and that's a bit of an understatement) yes, some of the things luke does in the EU directly contradicts the jedi code, but you forget, Luke is the first of a NEW pedagre of jedi, who have a different approach to the whole process. Luke is never taught not to love, not to marry, etc. YES, ALL of Kevin J anderson's books are bad, though some of his ideas are not. it's best to treat the events of the KJA books as a simple opening movie scroll. ( these events have happened) and not look too deeply into them. The wiki pages for those books is enough.

As for Lukes son, for those of you that don't know about Ben skywalker, At first, he more or less avoids the whole jedi thing for a long time, and becomes a GA security officer ( more or less a police detective) which in the books makes him a fascinating character when he does become a jedi. We end up with something akin to the old republic jedi in mentality.

But i digress. everyone is allowed their opinions, even if they are at odds with each other.

I'd like to weigh in on the whole "Jedis aren't supposed to get married" debate.

George Lucas is a terrible writer. I could care less when people tell me "If Lucas didn't say/do it, it isn't official canon" because Star Wars was only Expanded Universe for the 16 years between RotJ and TPM and that was what kept Star Wars so fresh in peoples minds who were hungering for a new movie. Go ahead and say what you will, but just cuz Lucas cherry picks certain things out of the Expanded Universe (like the name for Corruscant from the first novels) doesn't make them any better than what he didn't. Hell, the PT mixed with his OT edits just showed me how horrible of a person he is and how Star Wars is really 70% all about the Expanded Universe more than Georges terrible ideas.

So, when it comes to Luke getting married, I'm all for it. If you knew much about his relationship with Mara, you'd know he didn't marry her until they were well into their mid 30s and they didn't have their first, and only, kid until their mid 40s.

I could accept the whole thing about Jedis not being allowed to love, or whatever, if Gary Kurtz would have had his way with RotJ and Luke going off to become something of a hermit like Obi-Wan, but AGAIN it was idiotic Lucas that turned that film into the pos it was. And even still the forbidden love stuff was written relatively recently, long after anything the EU had ever written, and we're expected to think that it's garbage writing because Lucas deems it so afterwards?

Sorry, Lucas is a great business man and owns Star Wars, but the creative force that created everything behind it belongs to the hundreds of people he hired to do the thinking for him (pre-edits at least)

 

[Anzik]

Clearly the issue at hand is that many fans disagree with some of Lucas decisions, which is a valid point. You have some that say "He made it, so he gets to decide where it goes and you just have to deal with it." But I feel that since we plunk down a helluva lotta cash towards this stuff, it entitles us to an opinion. A lot of EU that I've read left me scratching my head and thinking "Did anyone at LFL actually read this idea? Have they ever seen the films?"
I think the selection of this particular model to represent Jade, isn't one of those disasters on par with Jar Jar or fart jokes. Of course my opinion doesn't really matter since I won't be purchasing her or Thrawn for my limited shelf space.

 

[Darth Snoopy]

According to today's Q&A there is potential for AH! Mara Jade!

If it's by AH! then SOLD!

summing up entire thread.


WAAHHHHHHHHH! if it's not a movie it's BAD!
If sideshow makes EU figures no one will buy them and then Ill not get the figures I want! And what I want is Right and everyone else should want it toooo!

 

[Mad Old Lu]

Coming back to the whole Luke getting married. I look at it this way: the Jedi were decimated because they stuck so close to those rules of being isolated. Anakin turned to the dark side because he was unwillingly ripped from his mother at a young age, and forced to suppress his emotions of love towards Padme. Maybe starting with Luke, the Jedi thought they should adapt with the times and be a little more flexible with the rules. Luke turned out okay as a Jedi despite being too old to start his training.

But I've only ever read one EU novel: Courtship of Leia. So I'm not really familiar with that whole world.

Oh, and Sideshow favors the AH version of Mara! Good enough for me!

 

[IrishJedi]

No one gets as easily butthurt and circles the wagons together like EU fans.

 

[jediknight120]

No one gets as easily butthurt and circles the wagons together like EU fans.

In fairness we are pretty quick to dispense beatings on them.

As I said, the EU doesn't bother me. I pay attention to what I like, and ignore the rest. Luke being married doesn't really bother me, I maintain that if the Jedi weren't such complete _______s to Anakin about emotions he might not have turned. Again, doesn't bother me either way because for me, the story of Star Wars ends at Endor.

 

[IrishJedi]

In fairness we are pretty quick to dispense beatings on them.

We don't dispense beatings on them, we share our distaste for (a majority of) the EU material, which they then take way too personally and get defensive about. It's the textbook definition of an "Apologist".

That said, I don't think any less of someone because they like the EU, or think that devalues them as a SW fan. I just think most of it is utter crap and I have my own strong reasons for that and don't mind sharing them. Nothing personal here.

 

[jediknight120]

Sometimes I think that we're just waiting for an EU fan to go defensive so we can jump them. Kinda like a big Mexican standoff.

 

[IrishJedi]

You mean like...

"I like Dark Empire! It's awesome that Palpatine had a ton of clones, thus negating the entire climax of ROTJ!"

Then...