Superman (July 11th, 2025)

[Dave_W]

There was nothing thoughtless about Zod's snapped neck.

While I have no beef with a 'fresh out of training, first day on the job Superman' being put in an impossible situation where he has no choice but to kill Zod, the way it was done in MoS wasn't an impossible situation.

He has Zod in a headlock and Snyder is telling me Superman couldn't have simply just moved his head away from those people? He couldn't have put his hand over his face to block the blast? He couldn't have wrestled Zod away and told the family to run while there was a chance? Maybe he jumped the gun and killed him due to the lack of experience, but that seems like a stretch.

I find this a lot with Snyder movies, I get what he was going for, but I always find the execution lacking.

 

[JorjeCroft]

While I have no beef with a 'fresh out of training, first day on the job Superman' being put in an impossible situation where he has no choice but to kill Zod, the way it was done in MoS wasn't an impossible situation.

He has Zod in a headlock and Snyder is telling me Superman couldn't have simply just moved his head away from those people? He couldn't have put his hand over his face to block the blast? He couldn't have wrestled Zod away and told the family to run while there was a chance? Maybe he jumped the gun and killed him due to the lack of experience, but that seems like a stretch.

I find this a lot with Snyder movies, I get what he was going for, but I always find the execution lacking.

I think you take the scene too simply. Doesn’t matter how many times Superman would try to avoid killing Zod, every time Zod would try to destroy Earth. Superman had no choice and in the real world everybody would do the same.
Personally I have never been LA Superman fan till Snyder, his take on the character is so deep and emotional. Won’t mention visuals and cinematography.

 

[thosemortalmen]

While I have no beef with a 'fresh out of training, first day on the job Superman' being put in an impossible situation where he has no choice but to kill Zod, the way it was done in MoS wasn't an impossible situation.

He has Zod in a headlock and Snyder is telling me Superman couldn't have simply just moved his head away from those people? He couldn't have put his hand over his face to block the blast? He couldn't have wrestled Zod away and told the family to run while there was a chance? Maybe he jumped the gun and killed him due to the lack of experience, but that seems like a stretch.

I find this a lot with Snyder movies, I get what he was going for, but I always find the execution lacking.

I beg to differ. The execution is pretty much there to see, juxtaposed.

The fact that Zod heat vision trajectory is deliberately chasing and aiming the already frightened family (have you ever experience such fear where you can hardly move), just showing how his headlock or grapple is slipping away, hence the plea from Supes to Zod to stop it. Then again Zod got a warrior death wish, and as we know heat vision hurts Kryptonian, and clearly shown earlier in the battle of Smallville, where Faora was intensely hurt by trying to close his eyes and also the big dude was backed and groaning when he was blasted by Supes heat vision. Supes only have seconds and will he gamble the choice? at what price? He knew well that Zod won't stop until every one on the earth gets it.

 

[Dave_W]

I think you take the scene too simply. Doesn’t matter how many times Superman would try to avoid killing Zod, every time Zod would try to destroy Earth. Superman had no choice and in the real world everybody would do the same.
Personally I have never been LA Superman fan till Snyder, his take on the character is so deep and emotional. Won’t mention visuals and cinematography.

I beg to differ. The execution is pretty much there to see, juxtaposed.

The fact that Zod heat vision trajectory is deliberately chasing and aiming the already frightened family (have you ever experience such fear where you can hardly move), just showing how his headlock or grapple is slipping away, hence the plea from Supes to Zod to stop it. Then again Zod got a warrior death wish, and as we know heat vision hurts Kryptonian, and clearly shown earlier in the battle of Smallville, where Faora was intensely hurt by trying to close his eyes and also the big dude was backed and groaning when he was blasted by Supes heat vision. Supes only have seconds and will he gamble the choice? at what price? He knew well that Zod won't stop until every one on the earth gets it.

I get it, I just don't buy it that there was nothing else he could have done in that situation. Sure it would have drawn the fight out longer and it needed to wrap up, but it's pretty easy to stop somebody looking at something. Snyder should have had Zod grab the kid by the throat or something, meaning that he would have died even if Superman tried to get him free so he had to kill Zod right there on the spot.

 

[thosemortalmen]

I get it, I just don't buy it that there was nothing else he could have done in that situation. Sure it would have drawn the fight out longer and it needed to wrap up, but it's pretty easy to stop somebody looking at something. Snyder should have had Zod grab the kid by the throat or something, meaning that he would have died even if Superman tried to get him free so he had to kill Zod right there on the spot.

Like i just told you and how would you do the scenario? this is seconds we're talking about and the bet was that high. Then again, it's not like he wanted to end Zod the way it happened, hence the anguish aftermath. Unlike the execution of SII powerless Zod or maybe the poor Nuclear Man on SIV ( believe me i'm a big, big fan of Reeve era likewise)

 

[Dave_W]

Like i just told you and how would you do the scenario? this is seconds we're talking about are the bet was that high. Then again, it's not like he wanted to end Zod the way it happened, hence the anguish aftermath. Unlike the execution of SII powerless Zod or maybe the poor Nuclear Man on SIV ( believe me i'm a big, big fan of Reeve era likewise)

It's a movie, not real life, it can be any scenario it wants to be and the "oh no his eyeballs are moving, my only course of action is to kill him" didn't work for me.

Zod could have lifted the kid up by his arms and threatened to rip his arms off if Superman didn't kill him first.

 

[T8OO]

I get it, I just don't buy it that there was nothing else he could have done in that situation. Sure it would have drawn the fight out longer and it needed to wrap up, but it's pretty easy to stop somebody looking at something. Snyder should have had Zod grab the kid by the throat or something, meaning that he would have died even if Superman tried to get him free so he had to kill Zod right there on the spot.

It's not a case of there was NOTHING else but everything else was a gamble on top of a gamble. Zod had shown how far he was willing to go. Every other option just stretches out the inevitable and puts more people at risk.
Considering how much flack Snyder's Superman got in universe and in real life for destruction and poor choices I find it strange that people hang onto this moment like another choice was a better choice without rewriting the whole movie.

 

[Sachiel]

While I have no beef with a 'fresh out of training, first day on the job Superman' being put in an impossible situation where he has no choice but to kill Zod, the way it was done in MoS wasn't an impossible situation.

He has Zod in a headlock and Snyder is telling me Superman couldn't have simply just moved his head away from those people? He couldn't have put his hand over his face to block the blast? He couldn't have wrestled Zod away and told the family to run while there was a chance? Maybe he jumped the gun and killed him due to the lack of experience, but that seems like a stretch.

I find this a lot with Snyder movies, I get what he was going for, but I always find the execution lacking.

Imagine if he did that and Zod's head exploded.

 

[Dave_W]

It's not a case of there was NOTHING else but everything else was a gamble on top of a gamble. Zod had shown how far he was willing to go. Every other option just stretches out the inevitable and puts more people at risk.
Considering how much flack Snyder's Superman got in universe and in real life for destruction and poor choices I find it strange that people hang onto this moment like another choice was a better choice without rewriting the whole movie.

It's not the killing, it's the "I can't stop him looking at someone" that I have an issue with. That's not an impossible situation, it's very risky to try and get out of that, but come on, if Snyder really wanted to test Superman's character and backed him into a corner, he should have put him in a tighter situation where there's absolutely no chance at all. That fact that he could twist his head to break his neck without accidentally killing the family means there was wiggle room for error.

 

[T8OO]

It's not the killing, it's the "I can't stop him looking at someone" that I have an issue with. That's not an impossible situation, it's very risky to try and get out of that, but come on, if Snyder really wanted to test Superman's character and backed him into a corner, he should have put him in a tighter situation where there's absolutely no chance at all. That fact that he could twist his head to break his neck without accidentally killing the family means there was wiggle room for error.

An absolutely impossible situation takes the choice out of Superman's hands.
They may have still died when he killed him. He made the hard choice and took the risk.

 

[Mondragon]

.

Snyder is telling me Superman couldn't have simply just moved his head away from those people? He couldn't have put his hand over his face to block the blast? He couldn't have wrestled Zod away and told the family to run while there was a chance? Maybe he jumped the gun...

Clearly should have been the next scene...

 

[Dave_W]

An absolutely impossible situation takes the choice out of Superman's hands.
They may have still died when he killed him. He made the hard choice and took the risk.

Personally, I'd rather see a Superman that has no choice but to kill and how he deals with that, than just chooses to kill because it was one of his options and it was worth the risk.

 

[ironwez20]

Oh boy here we go. Don’t get them started or I might have to step in . That will surely derail the thread

 

[T8OO]

Oh boy here we go. Don’t get them started or I might have to step in . That will surely derail the thread

Go off. Talk your truth. Say what you want buddy

 

[ironwez20]

Go off. Talk your truth. Say what you want buddy

. Good one

 

[thosemortalmen]

It's a movie, not real life, it can be any scenario it wants to be and the "oh no his eyeballs are moving, my only course of action is to kill him" didn't work for me.

Zod could have lifted the kid up by his arms and threatened to rip his arms off if Superman didn't kill him first.

Personally, I'd rather see a Superman that has no choice but to kill and how he deals with that, than just chooses to kill because it was one of his options and it was worth the risk.

Well, that's what it is, isn't it? Just like i said before: He has no choice but to and forced to kill Zod, because he was about to murder the poor family. If Zod had stopped using his heat vision, he will surely be alive, but Zod knew and he was giving Supes one last impossible option: choosing the impossible, side with your last kin or side with the adopted world he's been living all of his life.

Now, If we run by your logic, everything has other scenario that we can always pick and scrutinize upon. Example: Ra's could have lived, just grapple him and send him to jail, or Harvey could be alive if Bats use that Bat needle paralyze thing (the one in Rises) on him or just throw the batarang and grapple the heck out of the gun or whatnot. Is this also comes in the category of "lacking in execution"?

See what I mean?

 

[loki2371]

Is the Snyderverse thread?

Some fans give Snyder too much credit into how "deep" his thinking is/was. He's still a teen at heart and stuck in the 80's, when "Dark Heroes" were cool.... He still fantasizes about Miller's The Dark Knight. That's why Watchmen and 300 were so good.

And as far as Supes killing Zod, don't read into it too much. Simply take it as his choice to show the world (Earth) that was afraid of him, that he has chosen them and will be their protector. Even at the cost of his own Kryptonian people.

 

[karamazov80]

Just gonna say it... Gunn an overrated dud.

Guardians 1, is the only great thing he's ever done. Everything else has been by the numbers, average, fodder.

I'm a Gunn fan, and think he is going to give DC the best chance to succeed critically with their new film universe. But at the same time, I acknowledge that he has had diminished returns.

GOTG 2 wasn't nearly as exciting and interesting as GOTG 1. Same with Peacemaker. I enjoyed the heck out of it, but it still couldn't touch the awesomeness of his Suicide Squad film. Something like Super was great and out of left field, while Slither was a fun riff on various horror tropes, but they probably succeed really well in hindsight because they stand alone.

So for me, the novelty and creativity that Gunn brings to a totally new project is where he shines most unlike, say, Nolan or the Russos who met or exceeded their first comic movie with the follow-up. But his primary role in DC now is to get the ball rolling and oversee things. This Superman movie will be setting a big tone for what we can expect moving forward. I'm optimistic about it, despite the really crummy suit design choice.

 

[ironwez20]

Is the Snyderverse thread?

Some fans give Snyder too much credit into how "deep" his thinking is/was. He's still a teen at heart and stuck in the 80's, when "Dark Heroes" were cool.... He still fantasizes about Miller's The Dark Knight. That's why Watchmen and 300 were so good.

And as far as Supes killing Zod, don't read into it too much. Simply take it as his choice to show the world (Earth) that was afraid of him, that he has chosen them and will be their protector. Even at the cost of his own Kryptonian people.

I don’t think he’s a deep thinker at all lol. I have no idea where people got that from .but my guess is that when the backlash from his movies was at an all time high someone joked they meaning the world didn’t understand it and then a few good people took that to heart and here we are lol

 

[Bleah]

I enjoyed MOS but was there any reason though that the family, I don't know, couldn't walk out of the path of Zod's heat vision? They weren't really trapped in any sense.