Star Wars: The Last Jedi (Dec 15th, 2017)

[Otomofan]

Since we're getting personal, and I really don't know any of you guys...Jye, you're not a native English speaker right? I'm not saying that as an insult, I just had a vague recollection that you're not from America, right?

 

[JAWS]

JAWS is Trump a Mary Sue?

Under his new tax plan I am actually getting s rebate and don't have to pay (for the first time in 3 years).. So he can be whatever you want him to be

I guess if you think that his policies are working then in a way he is a Mary Sue since he had no "political" background.. But then again running a business makes you just as qualified as a community organizer.. Frankly very few are qualified..

I would argue he is not a Mary Sue as he handles things poorly at times like Trying to put a cease and desist on the new book rather then ignore it.. Many tweets are awful, and saying that there are some good people at a racist rally is no good..

A true Mary Sue would be able to do anything and all would approve..

Rey is a true Mary Sue.. Nobody can argue that everything she does really well without any formal training..

There are plenty who would argue against trump.

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Since we're getting personal, and I really don't know any of you guys...Jye, you're not a native English speaker right? I'm not saying that as an insult, I just had a vague recollection that you're not from America, right?

Jye be like

 

[Khev]

Rey is a true Mary Sue.. Nobody can argue that everything she does really well without any formal training..

She displays prowess with the Force without training but you can't say that for everything else. She doesn't use the pistol that Han gave her very well (fires with the safety on, misses more than she hits) and lightsaber dueling could be an extension of her stick fighting on Jakku. It's never specified that no one trained her how to fight and drive vehicles on Jakku, people are just making that assumption themselves.

Who taught Luke how to fire massive cannons in a swiveling space turret? Yet in his very first outing he's as good as the guy who *owns* the ship. I thought being as good as Han in the Falcon was a big no no...?

 

[JAWS]

Wasn't the Luke stuff pretty much all that you *did* like from TLJ??

I am not a hater of the Luke stuff.. Its not my fav.. I think it all could have been handled better.. But it was great and I mean GREAT to see MArk playing Luke again.. Far better the Fisher or Ford as Leia and Han..

I like the way the trailer made Luke look as it looked like there would be some real training and back and forth between Rey and Luke.. Instead.. Again nothing really happens with Rey and Luke... R2 and Yoda have more of an impact on him..

And While I don't mind his hologram trick, the fact that he dies feels like a bit of a waste.. Not that I need to see him swinging lightsabers or anything but it would have been nice to see him more involved in the next film..

I get that they want us to move along.. But I never asked for the OT cast to be in these films.. I have said it before and I think you agree.. The lives these characters we love went to **** after Jedi.. The deaths of our fav characters has been without the fanfare they deserve.. Its just all kind of sad.

But in a film where I have many issues.. Luke was the least of them.

Krampus guy is doing the new Godzilla?? Nice!

Yep.. Going to have Mothra, Rodan, and Ghidorah in is also!!

 

[koonfasa]

Luke only ever bulleseyed womprats in his T-16 back home...

Anyway just saw it for the third time. It just gets awesomer. I now rate it 6th of the nine above the Force Awakens.

 

[jye4ever]

Since we're getting personal, and I really don't know any of you guys...Jye, you're not a native English speaker right? I'm not saying that as an insult, I just had a vague recollection that you're not from America, right?

I am actually very fluent in English as well as other languages but correct engrish is not my first learned language.

But regardless where i’m from I am an American now.

Under his new tax plan I am actually getting s rebate and don't have to pay... So he can be whatever you want him to be

I guess if you think that his policies are working then in a way he is a Mary Sue since he had no "political" background.. But then again running a business makes you just as qualified as a community organizer.. Frankly very few are qualified..

I would argue he is not a Mary Sue as he handles things poorly at times like Trying to put a cease and desist on the new book rather then ignore it.. Many tweets are awful, and saying that there are some good people at a racist rally is no good..

A true Mary Sue would be able to do anything and all would approve..

Rey is a true Mary Sue.. Nobody can argue that everything she does really well without any formal training..

There are plenty who would argue against trump.

Finally a great answer from a man not afraid of his own shadow with thick skin who rolls with the punches without being offended.

I see Trump compared to Rey in this manner.

Some could even say Trumps training in the business world even if not directly connected to constitutional law or being a politician helped him sharpen his skills for the presidency similar to Rey’s experience in the desert being a tough scavenger who knows self defense, repair person and survival expert could translate to being great at using a saber or shooting the Falcon guns due to her hightened surrounding awareness and astuteness.

You could even say Rey draws from the force the same way Trump draws from his constitutional team of lawyers. Both guide the person in their appropriate path.

My point though is that Trump’s Mary Sue abilities is respected yet Rey’s is hated, why?

 

[jye4ever]

Jye be like

 

[JAWS]

She displays prowess with the Force without training but you can't say that for everything else. She doesn't use the pistol that Han gave her very well (fires with the safety on, misses more than she hits) and lightsaber dueling could be an extension of her stick fighting on Jakku. It's never specified that no one trained her how to fight and drive vehicles on Jakku, people are just making that assumption themselves.

Who taught Luke how to fire massive cannons in a swiveling space turret? Yet in his very first outing he's as good as the guy who *owns* the ship. I thought being as good as Han in the Falcon was a big no no...?

Come on Khev.. If you cant admit she is a Mary Sue then we can find no common ground..

1. SHe can understand Droids
2. She can understand Wookie
3. She states she has no idea how she flew the falcon but did a great job of it
4. She can do the Jedi mind trick after finding out a day earlier the force was real
5. She Fights off Kylo's mind control thingy
6. She force pulls a saber from Kylo
7. A girl who never picked up a saber before bested Kylo in a duel - Snoke's words not mine.
8. She flirts with the dark side but is not tempted in the slightest.
9. Her "test" or whatever the hell it is in the Dark Side sink hole has no ill effects and shows no signs of weakness or failure.
10. Kicks the **** of Snoke's guards and when watching it.. She appears better at it then Kylo.. But she is the hero so I will give that a pass
11. Blows a tone of Tie fighters (Not just two) easliy
12. Lifts a ton of Rocks (that leai can seem to do herself)
13. I would argue that she does not shoot a blaster well after she figures out how to turn off the safety.. After she kills a trooper or two she looks surprised at the gun as if to say "how did I do that" I thought it was yet another "set up" to bigger and better explanations in TLJ.

Do I really have to go through all of Luke's failures.. Go back and see that I gave like 5 examples on how luke really wasn't even that great a piolet.

 

[jye4ever]

Come on Khev.. If you cant admit she is a Mary Sue then we can find no common ground..

1. SHe can understand Droids
2. She can understand Wookie
3. She states she has no idea how she flew the falcon but did a great job of it
4. She can do the Jedi mind trick after finding out a day earlier the force was real
5. She Fights off Kylo's mind control thingy
6. She force pulls a saber from Kylo
7. A girl who never picked up a saber before bested Kylo in a duel - Snoke's words not mine.
8. She flirts with the dark side but is not tempted in the slightest.
9. Her "test" or whatever the hell it is in the Dark Side sink hole has no ill effects and shows no signs of weakness or failure.
10. Kicks the **** of Snoke's guards and when watching it.. She appears better at it then Kylo.. But she is the hero so I will give that a pass
11. Blows a tone of Tie fighters (Not just two) easliy
12. Lifts a ton of Rocks (that leai can seem to do herself)
13. I would argue that she does not shoot a blaster well after she figures out how to turn off the safety.. After she kills a trooper or two she looks surprised at the gun as if to say "how did I do that" I thought it was yet another "set up" to bigger and better explanations in TLJ.

Do I really have to go through all of Luke's failures.. Go back and see that I gave like 5 examples on how luke really wasn't even that great a piolet.

Of course she’s a Mary Sue silly, she’s Darth Vader afterall.

Wait until Kylo finds out in IX lol

 

[JAWS]

I am actually very fluent in English as well as other languages but correct engrish is not my first learned language.

But regardless where i’m from I am an American now.



Finally a great answer from a man not afraid of his own shadow with thick skin who rolls with the punches without being offended.

I see Trump compared to Rey in this manner.

Some could even say Trumps training in the business world even if not directly connected to constitutional law or being a politician helped him sharpen his skills for the presidency similar to Rey’s experience in the desert being a tough scavenger who knows self defense, repair person and survival expert could translate to being great at using a saber or shooting the Falcon guns due to her hightened surrounding awareness and astuteness.

You could even say Rey draws from the force the same way Trump draws from his constitutional team of lawyers. Both guide the person in their appropriate path.

My point though is that Trump’s Mary Sue abilities is respected yet Rey’s is hated, why?

Because I want my movies to have some Drama. I want my President to succeed.

My argument against Trump being a Mary Sue.. Is there has been a lot of Drama .

 

[jye4ever]

Because I want my movies to have some Drama. I want my President to succeed.

Great answer I can flow with that. lol @ your edit.

Thank You Orca.

True that Rey being a MS can deflate some of the drama but she is charming enough for it not to ruin the movies for me.

It’s Kylo’s movie too.

 

[Otomofan]

I am actually very fluent in English as well as other languages but correct engrish is not my first learned language.

But regardless where i’m from I am an American now.

That's awesome man....good for you! I wish I had that kind of drive. I've lived in Japan for years now and I can barely string words together. I'm a bad gaijin.

 

[JAWS]

Great answer I can flow with that.

Thank You Orca.

Hey did I screw up you name again

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Come on Khev.. If you cant admit she is a Mary Sue then we can find no common ground..

1. SHe can understand Droids
2. She can understand Wookie
3. She states she has no idea how she flew the falcon but did a great job of it
4. She can do the Jedi mind trick after finding out a day earlier the force was real
5. She Fights off Kylo's mind control thingy
6. She force pulls a saber from Kylo
7. A girl who never picked up a saber before bested Kylo in a duel - Snoke's words not mine.
8. She flirts with the dark side but is not tempted in the slightest.
9. Her "test" or whatever the hell it is in the Dark Side sink hole has no ill effects and shows no signs of weakness or failure.
10. Kicks the **** of Snoke's guards and when watching it.. She appears better at it then Kylo.. But she is the hero so I will give that a pass
11. Blows a tone of Tie fighters (Not just two) easliy
12. Lifts a ton of Rocks (that leai can seem to do herself)
13. I would argue that she does not shoot a blaster well after she figures out how to turn off the safety.. After she kills a trooper or two she looks surprised at the gun as if to say "how did I do that" I thought it was yet another "set up" to bigger and better explanations in TLJ.

Do I really have to go through all of Luke's failures.. Go back and see that I gave like 5 examples on how luke really wasn't even that great a piolet.

Whoa! She's so kewl!! I want to be just like Rey.

Rey is soooooo awesome, she was not only better than her mentors (Han and Luke), she inspired and changed them....damn, so kewl. I can't wait for Rey to own Yoda in episode 9.

 

[Khev]

Come on Khev.. If you cant admit she is a Mary Sue then we can find no common ground..

1. SHe can understand Droids
2. She can understand Wookie
3. She states she has no idea how she flew the falcon but did a great job of it
4. She can do the Jedi mind trick after finding out a day earlier the force was real
5. She Fights off Kylo's mind control thingy
6. She force pulls a saber from Kylo
7. A girl who never picked up a saber before bested Kylo in a duel - Snoke's words not mine.
8. She flirts with the dark side but is not tempted in the slightest.
9. Her "test" or whatever the hell it is in the Dark Side sink hole has no ill effects and shows no signs of weakness or failure.
10. Kicks the **** of Snoke's guards and when watching it.. She appears better at it then Kylo.. But she is the hero so I will give that a pass
11. Blows a tone of Tie fighters (Not just two) easliy
12. Lifts a ton of Rocks (that leai can seem to do herself)
13. I would argue that she does not shoot a blaster well after she figures out how to turn off the safety.. After she kills a trooper or two she looks surprised at the gun as if to say "how did I do that" I thought it was yet another "set up" to bigger and better explanations in TLJ.

Do I really have to go through all of Luke's failures.. Go back and see that I gave like 5 examples on how luke really wasn't even that great a piolet.

I never said that Luke started out as well as her, just that a lot of what people freak out about get a pass when it comes to other characters. If you compartmentalize each one none of it is that big a deal except for her use of the Force. Understanding aliens and droids and piloting the Falcon just makes her a crappy Lando (since he assumedly wouldn't have a hard time avoiding the *ground* when flying, lol.) I don't even think she was as skilled a fighter as the Praetorian Guards, she just had a lightsaber and they didn't. If I remember correctly when that last guard went all "Go Go from Kill Bill" and wrapped her up in his chains she had to turn off the lightsaber and reverse the handle to take him out. If she had a regular sword she couldn't have done that and would have been dead.

Yes she's "better" at more things than Luke but Luke had mentors and princesses constantly urging him to be his best self and join the fight. Rey existed in a vacuum for the most part so her "Mary Sue" qualities (yes I fully admit that with regard to her use of the Force) were more of a dramatic necessity.

It's not like she's the "best in the galaxy" at anything she does, she's just very good at a lot of different things.

 

[TonTon]

Under his new tax plan I am actually getting s rebate and don't have to pay... So he can be whatever you want him to be

I guess if you think that his policies are working then in a way he is a Mary Sue since he had no "political" background.. But then again running a business makes you just as qualified as a community organizer.. Frankly very few are qualified..

I would argue he is not a Mary Sue as he handles things poorly at times like Trying to put a cease and desist on the new book rather then ignore it.. Many tweets are awful, and saying that there are some good people at a racist rally is no good..

A true Mary Sue would be able to do anything and all would approve..

Rey is a true Mary Sue.. Nobody can argue that everything she does really well without any formal training..

There are plenty who would argue against trump.

Then state senator for 8 years, then a US senator for 4. Former Governor's would seem to be the most well equipped but there's not even that great a track record with the last few of those (Clinton, Bush, Carter).

Rey is indeed a Mary Sue though, and it's unfortunate because I really think in TFA they struck gold with Ridley's performance--it dropped off a bit in TLJ as it didn't play to her charm and her dynamic with Finn/Han matched her strengths better than the dynamic with Luke, even though anything with Luke comprised the best parts of the movie for me.

I think as you just mentioned to Khev, the being able to speak Wookie and her quick learning of mind control are perhaps the worst offenses in TFA, some of the rest can perhaps be explained or could have easily been explained. They are also both for the most part completely unnecessary too. They could have had the FO underestimate her and left her in a cell unshackled (like Leia) and have her best a grunt physically.

 

[crows]

 

[The Clown Prince of Crime]

Trump has tiny hands. He needs Yoda size saber.

 

[guyver1]