Prometheus Sequel (ALIEN: Covenant)

[fosing]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Prometheus was straight garbage.

landscape eye candy garbage.

 

[Magpie 7]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

If Scott had kept with the 20 foot Engineer's it would've been a natural progression that the Xeno born from the derelict's pilot would've been this huge Ultramorph. But what would've been even better was if a Xeno born out of an Engineer is the Queen Xeno, it just makes more sense and holds the story together much more tighter.

 

[abake]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

While Prometheus is a bit of a mess, I still respect the fact that Scott wanted to do something different. Too bad it didn't quite work.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

If Scott had kept with the 20 foot Engineer's it would've been a natural progression that the Xeno born from the derelict's pilot would've been this huge Ultramorph. But what would've been even better was if a Xeno born out of an Engineer is the Queen Xeno, it just makes more sense and holds the story together much more tighter.

I agree with all that, but I honestly don't like the Queen angle... I never liked to think of them as an insect colony. Don't get me wrong, I like the Queen... but I prefer O'bannon's version.

 

[Bo Shrek]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

It is funny when listening to the Prometheus commentary it felt that at many times Scott really did not have a clear idea of what he was doing. My guess is this movie will be a masterpiece years from now (however I do not see it today)

 

[Magpie 7]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I agree with all that, but I honestly don't like the Queen angle... I never liked to think of them as an insect colony. Don't get me wrong, I like the Queen... but I prefer O'bannon's version.

The Queen was perfect for Aliens going up against Ripley, it became Mother against Surrogate Mother and gave the film an edge right at the end. In AvP they killed the idea by having the Predators enslaving the Queen them produce xeno warriors to test the adolescent predators. Personally I like the idea that Xeno's can have two different reproductive methods, have O'Bannon's theory in most of the films and keep the Queen for Ripley and Ripley type characters such as Shaw.

 

[RIDDICK]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I respect the fact that Scott wanted to do something different.

For decades he wanted to make a movie around mysterious extraterrestrial creature from O'Bannon's story yet couldn't conceive a proper story on his own or let those who work in that field do their job. There's nothing to respect.

Ridley Scott is an awesome cinematographer and that's it.
Too often he pokes his arrogant nose where it doesn't belong.

 

[Bo Shrek]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Aliens was a very entertaining movie. What any movie should provide for the viewer (i loved it) unfortunately it killed the "Alien" creature. It made them into "shoot-em up" ants! I guess it was the price we pay for such a great film
I like what Alien 3 (assembly cut) tried to do which was bring it back to the original.

 

[Snake Plissken]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Aliens was a very entertaining movie. What any movie should provide for the viewer (i loved it) unfortunately it killed the "Alien" creature. It made them into "shoot-em up" ants! I guess it was the price we pay for such a great film
I like what Alien 3 (assembly cut) tried to do which was bring it back to the original.

couldn't agree more.

 

[Magpie 7]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Aliens was a very entertaining movie. What any movie should provide for the viewer (i loved it) unfortunately it killed the "Alien" creature. It made them into "shoot-em up" ants! I guess it was the price we pay for such a great film
I like what Alien 3 (assembly cut) tried to do which was bring it back to the original.

And the AvP brought it back to "shoot-em up" and did it very badly, destroying not only the Alien legacy but also the Predator legacy. My hope is that Blomkamp and Shane Black can resurrect these franchise's that Fox allowed to be destroyed.

 

[Plastic Bateman]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I love the movie as its own movie and love the look and the atmosphere. the story is retarded but the movie is amazing to watch and the music is amazing as well.

I HATE Lidelof but his first draft of the movie was not even as bad as it is now. Scott Asked him to make it more mysterious and to hide more stuff. Not even Lidelof made it as problematic as it is now.

that's ALL on Scott.... he made the movie he wanted to make.

I actually liked some of the things that were left deliberately vague - it was far more interesting to me, in terms of David's character, for him to have a brief, unsubtitled exchange with the Space Jockey than the original cut of that scene that went on for longer and was fully-subtitled. I liked that ambiguity, not being sure exactly what the two had said to each other and being left to draw your own conclusions as to why the Jockey beheaded David and killed Weyland.

I feel complaining about some of the things left unexplained is like complaining that they never explained what the Jockey in the original Alien was, or where the eggs came from, or why the ship crashed. Sometimes it's far more effective to just let the audience's imaginations consume them coming up with theories and explanations of their own.

Visually and aurally it's a tour-de-force of a movie. The world of cinema's going to be a lot poorer when Scott shuffles off this mortal coil.

 

[Xenoburger_]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I actually liked some of the things that were left deliberately vague - it was far more interesting to me, in terms of David's character, for him to have a brief, unsubtitled exchange with the Space Jockey than the original cut of that scene that went on for longer and was fully-subtitled. I liked that ambiguity, not being sure exactly what the two had said to each other and being left to draw your own conclusions as to why the Jockey beheaded David and killed Weyland.

I feel complaining about some of the things left unexplained is like complaining that they never explained what the Jockey in the original Alien was, or where the eggs came from, or why the ship crashed. Sometimes it's far more effective to just let the audience's imaginations consume them coming up with theories and explanations of their own.

Visually and aurally it's a tour-de-force of a movie. The world of cinema's going to be a lot poorer when Scott shuffles off this mortal coil.

Very well said. Virtually everyone on this site will disagree with you though.

 

[abake]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

For decades he wanted to make a movie around mysterious extraterrestrial creature from O'Bannon's story yet couldn't conceive a proper story on his own or let those who work in that field do their job. There's nothing to respect.

Ridley Scott is an awesome cinematographer and that's it.
Too often he pokes his arrogant nose where it doesn't belong.

From what I read/heard of the first script, it was very derivative of the first movie, which in the end isn't that interesting. I find it much more rewarding to try to go in a new direction, regardless of how long he had been pursuing that particular angle.
And I disagree that Scott is merely a cinematographer, I think his body of work is quite solid as a director.
At any rate, being the director of a movie, it is his job to poke his nose, arrogant or not, everywhere. That's how a director makes a movie his movie, and not the producer's or the writer's. I find it a bit naïve to think otherwise.
But maybe it's just me.

 

[rushmore223]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Ridley Scott is just another in a long list of Directors (and Artists) that started out creating great works, but fizzled out later in his career. I find it sad that many trash his career and solid directing abilities simply because his most recent works aren't as good as his older films. It's like the old saying about "your only as good as your last movie". A lot of people on here with short term memories. Scott has left an indelible mark on cinema, his creative spark may not be what it was, but it doesn't erase the successes of his past.

To say he sticks his nose where it doesn't belong is galling, hes the director, that's exactly what he's supposed to do. You can not see his movie as protest, but thats pretty much it.

 

[abake]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I actually liked some of the things that were left deliberately vague - it was far more interesting to me, in terms of David's character, for him to have a brief, unsubtitled exchange with the Space Jockey than the original cut of that scene that went on for longer and was fully-subtitled. I liked that ambiguity, not being sure exactly what the two had said to each other and being left to draw your own conclusions as to why the Jockey beheaded David and killed Weyland.

I feel complaining about some of the things left unexplained is like complaining that they never explained what the Jockey in the original Alien was, or where the eggs came from, or why the ship crashed. Sometimes it's far more effective to just let the audience's imaginations consume them coming up with theories and explanations of their own.

Visually and aurally it's a tour-de-force of a movie. The world of cinema's going to be a lot poorer when Scott shuffles off this mortal coil.

Agreed.
On the movie, I don't find the unanswered questions annoying, I find some of the clumsy writing annoying.
- They arrive at the planet, immediately enter the atmosphere, and the immediately find the structure they are looking for? Visually?
- The captain of the ship decides, on some flimsy evidence, that he's going to believe the rantings of the silly scientist who got it all wrong to begin with, and commit suicide. But not only that, his comrades support him on even flimsier evidence!

And there are other little details here and there...

As far as Scott, although the man is clearly past his prime, I do think he has given us great movies throughout his career.

 

[Plastic Bateman]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

Agreed.
On the movie, I don't find the unanswered questions annoying, I find some of the clumsy writing annoying.
- They arrive at the planet, immediately enter the atmosphere, and the immediately find the structure they are looking for? Visually?
- The captain of the ship decides, on some flimsy evidence, that he's going to believe the rantings of the silly scientist who got it all wrong to begin with, and commit suicide. But not only that, his comrades support him on even flimsier evidence!

And there are other little details here and there...

As far as Scott, although the man is clearly past his prime, I do think he has given us great movies throughout his career.

Prometheus needed much less dialogue. In fact most modern films need much less dialogue and exposition. Film's a visual medium, you don't need to show and tell.

 

[olbertfrog]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I actually liked some of the things that were left deliberately vague - it was far more interesting to me, in terms of David's character, for him to have a brief, unsubtitled exchange with the Space Jockey than the original cut of that scene that went on for longer and was fully-subtitled. I liked that ambiguity, not being sure exactly what the two had said to each other and being left to draw your own conclusions as to why the Jockey beheaded David and killed Weyland.

I feel complaining about some of the things left unexplained is like complaining that they never explained what the Jockey in the original Alien was, or where the eggs came from, or why the ship crashed. Sometimes it's far more effective to just let the audience's imaginations consume them coming up with theories and explanations of their own.

Visually and aurally it's a tour-de-force of a movie. The world of cinema's going to be a lot poorer when Scott shuffles off this mortal coil.

There is nothing vague in the movie.
Basically everything is in the scripts, either Sphait our Lindelof.
All the muddling cale after, at the edit where Scott tried to recapture the mystery of the original by removing lines or scenes.
As from where does the Alien Jockey, eggs and Ship come from, you saw it in PROMETHEUS.
Just restore the planet name, replace the vase by eggs and the rest Will flow...
For exemple to show you how much Scott did not care, he did not even retouched in post the chestbursted engineers pile of bodies, or the chest holes in the sarcophagus/pilot room.
Scott decided at the last minute to not make it a direct prequel but basically its still is.

 

[Devil_666]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

iunno.. it's a funny thing. When someone creates a mystery for a story, that actually has an answer, that's cool. But to me, there's a difference between that and someone either flat out not knowing/caring about the solution to the mystery THEY created (like Lindelof's entire writing career) or someone unintentionally creating a mystery because of reasons outside of the context of the project. Case in point, Alien. The reason it's hard to answer the "mysteries" in Alien is because they aren't mysteries. They were aesthetic/design choices. Specifically Giger's design choices.

If you look at most of the questions and mysteries with Alien almost all of them stem from Giger's work and not really the story itself. And that's disappointing, because things like that are either never explained (because they have no explanation) or people attempt to explain them after the fact, but aren't meticulous and detail orientated enough to make sure the things they're trying to explain make sense and line up with the other film/films. Which is one of the biggest flaws with Prometheus.

If you eliminated the entire Alien connection in Prometheus it would be a better film.

 

[Python]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I actually liked some of the things that were left deliberately vague - it was far more interesting to me, in terms of David's character, for him to have a brief, unsubtitled exchange with the Space Jockey than the original cut of that scene that went on for longer and was fully-subtitled. I liked that ambiguity, not being sure exactly what the two had said to each other and being left to draw your own conclusions as to why the Jockey beheaded David and killed Weyland.

I feel complaining about some of the things left unexplained is like complaining that they never explained what the Jockey in the original Alien was, or where the eggs came from, or why the ship crashed. Sometimes it's far more effective to just let the audience's imaginations consume them coming up with theories and explanations of their own.

Visually and aurally it's a tour-de-force of a movie. The world of cinema's going to be a lot poorer when Scott shuffles off this mortal coil.

I disagree, I'm all for vagueness and mystery at times, the original space jockey being a good example of that. But he took it way too far with Prometheus as so much was left untold, it started feeling lazy/tedious rather than mysterious and I'm actually a fan of the movie. When you saw the space jockey in Alien, it didn't really matter what it was ultimately, you could let your imagination run wild and it didn't affect the story at all. What we were left with in Prometheus however was an angry Engineer that went bat **** crazy with no explanation what so ever. The extended scene where he speaks back was much better imo, it made him seem fearsome and powerful also (although I don't remember it being fully subtitled?) And the scenes with him looking at the books etc all added to his character which is somewhat absent in Prometheus as we know it. I really hope they expand upon the Engineers in P2. Just a little reasoning behind why they created us, and for what purpose would be nice. But more than anything, the characters need to be less ridiculous and clichéd as several of them were first time around, the idiot biologist for starters.

 

[abake]

Re: Prometheus Sequel (March 2016)

I thought it was crystal clear why the engineer went berserk, to me he felt that David was an abomination. Creating artificial intelligence was a big no-no for beings who sacrificed themselves in order to bring sentient life to distant planets.
At first he was mollified, after all, these creatures they were meant to destroy because they had turned out so bad had managed to survive and find their creators, not bad at all for such a hopeless bunch. But then he gets, he understands what is going on and it just confirms what the engineers knew all along along: mankind had to be destroyed.
So he gets medieval on David ass.