Episode One 10th Anniversary in '09...

[thenammagazine]

I read...but admittedly, I save my time reading good books, not modern sci-fi crap for fan boys with so little interest in anything outside of Star Wars that they have to fill their silly life with poorly written drivel.

But yet, here you are, whining in a forum about which you have little knowledge and admittedly little interest. That counteracts your statement. So my question is, what does that say about you? Don't you have anything better to do?

 

[ProgMatinee]

But yet, here you are, whining in a forum about which you have little knowledge and admittedly little interest. That counteracts your statement. So my question is, what does that say about you? Don't you have anything better to do?

You're incorrect on multiple counts. This forum is about toys. I know a lot about toys. I know a lot about Star Wars 1/6th toys. I have a lot of interest in toys.
Secondly, this specific thread is about The Phantom Menace specifically. I know a lot and have a lot of interest in that film.

What this thread wasn't about originally was EU crap. When it became about EU crap I mentioned how I hate how every SW thread has to develope into commentary about ridiculous made up crap thats meant to make geeks feel better about Lucas just making something up as the films went along. People can't accept that a person in the background of a scene was just there to add color. The character needs meaning and must have saved the universe one way or another, otherwise he wouldn't have been sitting in Mos Eisley Cantina that day.

Regarding do I have anything better to do than argue with you. The answer is no. Also, don't get so worked up over my posts.

 

[thenammagazine]

You're incorrect on multiple counts. This forum is about toys. I know a lot about toys. I know a lot about Star Wars 1/6th toys. I have a lot of interest in toys.
Secondly, this specific thread is about The Phantom Menace specifically. I know a lot and have a lot of interest in that film.

What this thread wasn't about originally was EU crap. When it became about EU crap I mentioned how I hate how every SW thread has to develope into commentary about ridiculous made up crap thats meant to make geeks feel better about Lucas just making something up as the films went along. People can't accept that a person in the background of a scene was just there to add color. The character needs meaning and must have saved the universe one way or another, otherwise he wouldn't have been sitting in Mos Eisley Cantina that day.

Regarding do I have anything better to do than argue with you. The answer is no. Also, don't get so worked up over my posts.

Correction noted, I should've used the word "thread," not Forum. But the current discussion (still entirely relevant to TMP) isn't about "EU crap," it's about the lightsaber battles in TMP, AOTC, ROTS and ANH, primarily about how Obi Wan's skills have been inconsistent starting in The Phantom Menace, through A New Hope. People might be using EU sources to "add" to the current discussion or reinforce other peoples' points, but the current topic has never swayed from those lightsaber battles.

 

[ProgMatinee]

Personally I think the differences easily chalk up to a few things than don't need any kind of "fighting style" dialog at all.

1. Alec Guiness was an old man.
2. It was necessary to have a quick scene.
3. George Lucas wasn't concerned about the fight scene being dramatic because the drama was supposed to be about Luke, Han, Leia and co escaping the DS.
4. In the PTs Lucas felt the need to entertain current kids and grown adults with better sword fighting.
5. Lucas had an awesome bad guy in Maul to experiment with.

I don't see the fun in making up back story to make it all connect.

 

[thenammagazine]

Personally I think the differences easily chalk up to a few things than don't need any kind of "fighting style" dialog at all.

1. Alec Guiness was an old man.
2. It was necessary to have a quick scene.
3. George Lucas wasn't concerned about the fight scene being dramatic because the drama was supposed to be about Luke, Han, Leia and co escaping the DS.
4. In the PTs Lucas felt the need to entertain current kids and grown adults with better sword fighting.
5. Lucas had an awesome bad guy in Maul to experiment with.

I don't see the fun in making up back story to make it all connect.

Well, that's your opinion. But in your original post, you kinda dissed everyone who was adding info to a question about the films. They were adding to a discussion that was currently in progress. Your post was demeaning and irrelevant to what was being discussed.

Additionally, I think your 1st and 3rd points are off. Proof is in the pudding. The battle was so well coreographed and rehearsed that the stars were able to pull off the scene without the props. That hardly sounds like something that Lucas wasn't concerned with, but the exact opposite with it being a crucial scene in the movie where we actually got to see a Jedi and a Sith do battle. That duel alone is arguably what cemented Star Wars into every kid's mind. "I WANT TO BE A JEDI!" Your 2nd, 4th and 5th are entirely irrelevant as they don't address the inconsistency in Obi Wan's skills between the three prequels, which was the relative question being addressed in the current discussion: "WTF happened to Obi Wan's lightsaber skills after TMP?" After which, from whatever source, people furthered the discussion until your crass post.

 

[ProgMatinee]

My points 2-5 have everything to do with the change in fighting style because points 2 and 3 infer that "style" was irrelevant to the filming and points 4 and 5 infer that "style" became relevant to filming.

Another easy point for explaining the difference is that there are 2 different actors in the roles.

I believe you when you say Guiness and Prowse practiced, but I disagree with an assertion that they came up with any specific "style" beyond: "David you hold with one hand and Alec you hold with two".

When the PT came around I bet they just came up with whatever they though would look cool and Ewan was comfortable with. Sorry if this is crass, but any story beyond that is geeks grasping at straws.

 

[thenammagazine]

My points 2-5 have everything to do with the change in fighting style because points 2 and 3 infer that "style" was irrelevant to the filming and points 4 and 5 infer that "style" became relevant to filming.

Another easy point for explaining the difference is that there are 2 different actors in the roles.

I believe you when you say Guiness and Prowse practiced, but I disagree with an assertion that they came up with any specific "style" beyond: "David you hold with one hand and Alec you hold with two".

When the PT came around I bet they just came up with whatever they though would look cool and Ewan was comfortable with. Sorry if this is crass, but any story beyond that is geeks grasping at straws.

They had fencing coaches for the choreography in the OT, from ANH through ROTJ. It was more than just two gorillas beating each other with sticks. I believe Bob Anderson was the coordinator and fencing coach for ANH (don't quote me on the name though).

For TPM, the lightsaber scenes were choreographed by Ray Park (Maul) himself.

If you watch any of the behind-the-scenes footage from just about any of the films, both PT and OT, you can see that ALL of the lightsaber scenes were well rehearsed and thoroughly choreographed by stunt coordinators before the actors even had the chance to rehearse them.

 

[ProgMatinee]

I'm thinking that the differences are easily explained as "he made it up as he went along" according to what fit his time, budget, actors, and story needs.

Obi-Wan couldn't go into a lengthy duel with Vader in ANH because the scene was happening in front of Luke and Luke had to get the hell out of there to avoid capture. So it had to be a quick scene which couldn't flesh out a style. Alec Guiness was old so they couldn't have him leap around and frankly I doubt they were thinking about making a film 22 years later to showing Obi-Wan fighting.

When they did decide to make TPM they needed to flesh out for a longer duel scene plus numerous droid slicing, so Obi-Wan's style also gets fleshed out. Maul is a dynamic character played by a dynamic actor, so likewise in order for Obi-Wan not to look like a putz fighting exactly like Alec did in ANH they bolstered his skills out.

Sorry its not as exciting as the EU makes it.

 

[thenammagazine]

I'm thinking that the differences are easily explained as "he made it up as he went along" according to what fit his time, budget, actors, and story needs.

Obi-Wan couldn't go into a lengthy duel with Vader in ANH because the scene was happening in front of Luke and Luke had to get the hell out of there to avoid capture. So it had to be a quick scene which couldn't flesh out a style. Alec Guiness was old so they couldn't have him leap around and frankly I doubt they were thinking about making a film 22 years later to showing Obi-Wan fighting.

When they did decide to make TPM they needed to flesh out a longer scene, so Ob-Wan's style also gets fleshed out. Maul is a dynamic character played by a dynamic actor, so likewise in order for Obi-Wan not to look like a putz fighting exactly like Alec did in ANH they bolstered his skills out.

Sorry its not as exciting as the EU makes it.

Once again, you miss the core of the question. It wasn't comparing the PT to the OT. It was mainly concerning the vast inconsistencies between the three prequel movies.

Although that got me to thinking. WTF happened to Obi Wan's lightsaber skills?! They were at the peak of awesomeness in TPM. His skills bailed during AOTC to the level of being mediocre IF that, beaten by Dooku's sufi dancing saber strokes. Then completely inconsistent in ROTS. How could he beat Grevious wielding 4 lightsabers with the pinpoint accuracy of a droid, yet just prior, completely put to pasture by Dooku with a simple force push?! Then on Mustafar, he's about 2/3 to the TPM skill level for the end battle with Vader. As for ANH, he was just about as limp as Herbert the Pervert's portrayal of him in Blue Harvest.

The main context of my question was about the major inconsistencies of his lightsaber skills in the PT with a joke thrown in about ANH at the end.

 

[ProgMatinee]

OOOOOOOOOOOOOH. I see. You're right in that I misinterpreted this discussion.

I never noticed a change between the 3 PT films at all in style, only the quality of the fight scenes from a film point of view.

IMO the lightsaber action in TPM is top notch from the droid stuff to the final duel with Maul. AOTC was a piece of crap in almost all respects and IMO the end duel in ROTS wasn't that special.

I think it was just a degrading of choreography and coolness, especially in the ridiculousness of the Dooku character.

 

[IrishJedi]

Miltant EU Apologists may represent the nadir of SW fandom, and that's saying a lot.

Well, they at least give a run for their money against the other group: some of the more gung-ho members of the 501st who take themselves way too seriously and act like they're actually part of some regimented miltary group or something.

Or maybe the 200+ lb chicks who think they can/should wear Slave Leia outfits.

Who said SW wasn't funny anymore?

 

[maddogjwn13]

I can't believe its 10 years old...I'm getting old...

 

[thenammagazine]

Here's a question. Do you think Lucas will release Special Editions of the PT since the 10th anniversary is coming up? It would at least be nice to release it on BluRay.

 

[arnax161]

I just ignore the prequel trilogies...My two year old daughter is going to grow up with the Original Trilogy without all the CGI garbage.

 

[Darth Madden]

Here's a question. Do you think Lucas will release Special Editions of the PT since the 10th anniversary is coming up? It would at least be nice to release it on BluRay.

I thought a new TPM was all ready in the works replacing that crappy Yoda.

 

[IrishJedi]

TPM Puppet Yoda was replaced by ILM during the production of ROTS. But it hasn't been released within the film itself yet. The next time TPM is released (in any format) Yoda will be the CG incarnation and not the mongoloid puppet.

 

[D. Martin]

I doubt we'll ever see a Sideshow Jar Jar. Remember how badly Lucas was hated on for Jar Jar? So much so, that the entire Empire is Jar Jar's fault. He led the voting for the emergency powers to the chancellor. /mfao! I'd love to see the HATE messages Sideshow would get from all the OT freaks if they made a Jar Jar. Be a great April Fool's joke though!

Tom Gilliland worked on Jar Jar for TPM, so I think we'll see one eventually.

 

[D. Martin]

TPM Puppet Yoda was replaced by ILM during the production of ROTS. But it hasn't been released within the film itself yet. The next time TPM is released (in any format) Yoda will be the CG incarnation and not the mongoloid puppet.

Mongoloid puppet. That's funny (and too true)

 

[thenammagazine]

Tom Gilliland worked on Jar Jar for TPM, so I think we'll see one eventually.

Funny you should say that. I came across this earlier today. Here's what Tom, himself, had to say about Jar Jar:

RebelScum.com: "Are there any characters you can safely are not currently being considered for any of the lines?"

Tom Gilliland: "Jar Jar Binks"

You can read the whole interview here!

 

[OSCORP]

I'm hoping SS realizes what year it is (and cares enough) and gets the hobbit body to use with some Anakin EP1 love. And TPM obi, i would also love a Senator Palpatine.