Star Wars: Andor (September 21st, 2022)

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jye4ever

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Epic post by ajp (as usual) and I agree for the most part BUT……

I’m not willing to throw out Mando S1/S2 which was already miles better than the PT/ST.

Yes Andor is everything ajp and others have said and I love every second of it for those exact reasons but i’m just not ready to throw out Mando S1/S2 because of Andor’s new mature tone therefore I am still looking forward to Mando S3 to continue providing the swashbuckling aspects of SW that I enjoy BUT it better be Mando quality swashbuckling and not BOBF quality god that show was embarrassing lol

So the lesson here is that ajp, khev and all of us Andor supporters weep for a-dev’s lack of vision.

Come lets have a meeting with how we’re going to get a-dev onboard with us visionaries.

If it worked for Sass it can work on a-dev…

:grouphug
 

ScoutingForToys

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Having grown up with SW being absent on screen for 16 years, re-watching these Andor episodes is all I'll need until the second season. That's more than enough Disney+ SW for my personal canon; gotta be at least 8 to 10 hours there. And all of it elevating the OT! The other shows do the opposite for me by ratcheting up the cartoonishness (and outright stupidity at times). And I just can't reconcile Andor as existing in the same reality with those other stories, so I don't need 'em at all.

My version of SW works just fine without a Boba Fett who recruits a scooter gang, gets flummoxed by a locked door, opts to ride a Rancor as his best battle plan, and has a life-altering epiphany from snorting a lizard.

My SW doesn't work as well with an Obi-Wan Kenobi who plays speedball with giant boulders yet fancies himself useless in the struggle against the Empire unless he's hidden away to watch over a boy savior who won't be able to do anything remotely similar to that for decades.

My Darth Vader isn't a credible threat if he's some halfwit who loses his composure at the drop of a hat and acts more like a Jason Voorhies wannabe than a cerebral figure with some emotional control. And he doesn't rip starships down from the sky one day, only to just forget how powerful he is years later for some unknown reason.

The Force as I prefer it isn't mastered by babies who haven't yet learned to speak, to the point of lifting charging rhinos and doing "Force healing." And there's also no series of time-traveling portals housed in mystical caves, nor "spirit animals," nor hyperspace-capable whales, or whatever other Filoniisms will be brought over into Ahsoka and/or other Rebels live-action shows that get made.

The Andor finale was more rewarding than I hoped for, and made the whole season even better as a result. The show may not be for every fan, but it certainly is for me. That other stuff probably works better for some, and that's fine. There's something for everyone now. And for that, I genuinely thank Tony Gilroy and his crew. They provided an alternative that can be embraced by a portion of the audience woefully underserved by the rest.

My ultimate satisfaction from this show is that it seemed to understand that human drama elements of preserving freedom by overcoming tyranny, helping family members find their path to virtue, and forging one's own destiny in life are all universally relatable and compelling parts of SW which can be the focus (and without retreading any old ground either). Superficial spectacle makes for short-lived fads, but it's substance that lasts. Andor will last. Couldn't be more proud as a SW fan, or more grateful. What an incredible payoff to such finely-constructed storytelling throughout! Outstanding on every level that matters.

Great post, agree with all your points.

With Andor I've realised what it is I've been wanting from Star Wars these last few years but didn't realise it until I had it.
I didn't like BoBF or Kenobi in the first place, both dreadful, but looking back at them after Andor, they seem so much worse.
Even The Mandalorian, looking back after Andor, just seems so childish in comparison. Still very enjoyable, silly fun though, even if it does have elements I didn't care for. As a whole, it is one of the better things to come out of Disney Star Wars, even if it is a bit of a mixed bag.

I have to agree with the Filoni stuff. I know he's beloved by many fans and I'm just old now and didn't grow up with the TCW etc but I agree with everything you wrote about him. He's not terrible or anything, but I'm not a fan of his magic space whales, his spirit animals, that Force time travel thing etc etc.
I suspect Favreau was balancing his Filonism out somewhat with The Mandalorian.

I've started to just take small bits of Star Wars that I like and fit in with what I've loved from Star Wars for the last 40 odd years.
Andor fits nicely in with that.
OT, some of the older pre-PT EU books and Dark Horse comics, Andor and, even though its a mixed bag of good and bad, Rogue One. The Mandalorian to finish off with.
That gives me a nice slice of Star Wars I think.

So for me, Mando season 3 early next year and the long wait for Andor season 2 are the only things coming up to add to my little slice of personal Star Wars.
It's taken me a while but I've made my peace with the fact that the majority of current Star Wars isn’t for me.

But yes, agree that Andor is a wonderful gift to particular Star Wars fans that really needed it (recognising it's not every fans cup of tea), following on from some really dreadful stuff. It's been a wonderful addition to canon, that builds the OT and benefits the overall story of Star Wars.
Sounds like we're only getting 2 seasons and I've heard Gilroy isnt going to do anything more with Star Wars after, so Andor may be all we get in this vein, but so be it.
 

ScoutingForToys

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Epic post by ajp (as usual) and I agree for the most part BUT……

I’m not willing to throw out Mando S1/S2 which was already miles better than the PT/ST.

Yes Andor is everything ajp and others have said and I love every second of it for those exact reasons but i’m just not ready to throw out Mando S1/S2 because of Andor’s new mature tone therefore I am still looking forward to Mando S3 to continue providing the swashbuckling aspects of SW that I enjoy BUT it better be Mando quality swashbuckling and not BOBF quality god that show was embarrassing lol

So the lesson here is that ajp, khev and all of us Andor supporters weep for a-dev’s lack of vision.

Come lets have a meeting with how we’re going to get a-dev onboard with us visionaries.

If it worked for Sass it can work on a-dev…

:grouphug

You make a really good point about Mando being swashbuckling Star Wars done quite well. I'd agree with that.
I did prefer season 1 to season 2 but there's definitely room for the adult and brilliantly written Andor and the dumb and fun adventure that is Mando.
Star Wars can be both and fans can enjoy which parts they like.
There's room for both in my little personal Star Wars pocket galaxy.
No room for the PT, ST, BoBF or Kenobi though.
I know other fans love them, we all have our own personal taste, they're just not for me.
Much happier now I've dropped the, all is canon and must be accepted view point and just pick out the few bits I do like. Doesn't leave me with much upcoming Star Wars to look forward to but as this point I don't care.
I've stuff I do like, we've just had the excellent Andor, with a second season coming in the future and we've got swashbuckling Mando season 3 on the way.
 
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Was anyone else dying to see Dedra and Syril start full on making out in the storeroom for like...a good solid 10 minutes? Or was that just me?
Either that or see Syril leaning in for a kiss only for Dedra to knee him in the balls and leave him writhing in pain on the ground, then pause while walking away and spit out with disgust that "I suppose I should thank you for saving my life" line lol...
 
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My season 2 prediction:

Spoiler Spoiler:
Maybe more like
Spoiler Spoiler:
 

punisher1974

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I felt the show was too much of a departure in tone from even the more serious movies like Empire and Rogue One - and therefore I have trouble reconciling it with anything that came before.

It certainly wasn't an embarrassment like so much of the PT, the ST, BOBF and Obi-Wan but for different reasons I equally would not be in a hurry to watch it again. That's just me.
I grew up watching war movies with my father so maybe that's one of the things I like about Andor. I like the fact that no Jedi or lightsabers have shown up. Makes the fighting and uprising more impactful since these are everyday people picking up the fight. I like that Star Wars can have different tones and not always end up on Tattooine or mention the Skywalkers.
 

wormlander

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Andor goes network tonight on ABC.

Guess Disney is getting its mileage out of it. First time for a Disney streaming show to network, isn't it? Must have been the deal with Gilroy.
...or they finally realized the target audience isn't on Disney+ and they wanted this show to actually get some views 😉
 

Sassafras

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Epic post by ajp (as usual) and I agree for the most part BUT……

I’m not willing to throw out Mando S1/S2 which was already miles better than the PT/ST.

Yes Andor is everything ajp and others have said and I love every second of it for those exact reasons but i’m just not ready to throw out Mando S1/S2 because of Andor’s new mature tone therefore I am still looking forward to Mando S3 to continue providing the swashbuckling aspects of SW that I enjoy BUT it better be Mando quality swashbuckling and not BOBF quality god that show was embarrassing lol

So the lesson here is that ajp, khev and all of us Andor supporters weep for a-dev’s lack of vision.

Come lets have a meeting with how we’re going to get a-dev onboard with us visionaries.

If it worked for Sass it can work on a-dev…

:grouphug
LOL:duff

Anyway for myself, tho IMO the Mandos watered it down off and on, by bringing in the tired baby-Jedi-trained-on-Coruscant been there done that trope (when for one thing, there were lots of Jedi temples, and IMO it would've been far more interesting to have one of those, and made more sense, as IMO it's idiotic to assume even the Jedi would have taken a baby for chrissake - where's his mom/dad? Was Qui-Gon down in the nursery? WTF)

But that to me was (originally) a deep enough theme, a child from a race of innate force wielders, untrained, so you never knew what he might do. As well as Mando wrestling with his code, and identity, and coming to terms with what being a Mandalorian really means. Din D'jarin IMO is one of the more fascinating characters in Star Wars. There's that purity of his code, which now keeps getting battered, especially by this unexpected child.:monkey2:monkey2:monkey2:D He's honorable but doesn't flinch at taking the trash out.

IMO there's room for both Mando and SW, as long as Mando sticks to business and isn't hijacked as commercials for other shows or has too much boring rehash. Some awesome episodes like when Boba showed up.

Star Wars can be both and fans can enjoy which parts they like.
There's room for both in my little personal Star Wars pocket galaxy.
No room for the PT, ST, BoBF or Kenobi though.
I know other fans love them, we all have our own personal taste, they're just not for me.

Well, I kinda luv Boba in a way. ESPECIALLY after Obi where the writing was horrific and it was painful watching McGregor work so hard with &^% material. At least Boba and Fennic seemed to just roll with it.:lol Say what you like, at least Boba is stuffed with - stuff. Candy Power Rangers, dancing and cool looking Tuskens, plus the bonus Mando episode which was badass.:p

Andor's just - extraordinary. Luthen Rael for me is a favorite, but [email protected] this show is packed with characters like Cassian, Mon Mothma (holy &^% the finale!), Cinta...even the droid.

I see a lot of poverty and another display case in the future.😁 Also bingewatching Andor with a turkey sandwich.
 
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a-dev

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I grew up watching war movies with my father so maybe that's one of the things I like about Andor. I like the fact that no Jedi or lightsabers have shown up. Makes the fighting and uprising more impactful since these are everyday people picking up the fight. I like that Star Wars can have different tones and not always end up on Tattooine or mention the Skywalkers.
Fair enough, although I myself didn't specify that I needed Jedi/Sith, lightsabers and Skywalkers in this.
 

ScoutingForToys

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Fair enough, although I myself didn't specify that I needed Jedi/Sith, lightsabers and Skywalkers in this.
I'm going to go as far as to say that The Force, the Jedi and the Sith are the weakest parts of Star Wars. Especially the way they're portrayed these days. Super heroes with super powers.
I've always loved the non Force users parts of Star Wars. The rogues, the hives of scum and villainy, the Rebels vs Empire stories, the military factions, the Western style flavours.
Now I just find the whole Jedi and Sith thing so obnoxious.
I appreciate the Force and the Jedi have been important since the OT but I miss the monks with more limited powers. Where its just a part of the overall picture.
Post PT they've become such an enormous focus to Star Wars, they're bloody everywhere. They've become the biggest part of Star Wars. To many fans, its just not Star Wars without a lightsaber appearing on screen.
They're power creep and ever increasing move set and abilities.
Once upon a time they felt much more grounded and understated. Now they're Marvel heroes. I find it so jarring having them in the same universe as something like Andor or even Solo or RO.
It's refreshing to have a show like Andor where the bathrobe wearing, glowstick twirling boring buggers don't show up at all.
 
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I felt the show was too much of a departure in tone from even the more serious movies like Empire and Rogue One - and therefore I have trouble reconciling it with anything that came before.

It certainly wasn't an embarrassment like so much of the PT, the ST, BOBF and Obi-Wan but for different reasons I equally would not be in a hurry to watch it again. That's just me.
With respect to Rogue One I don't follow, as that leads off with Andor killing his informant rather than letting him be captured. He's also tasked with assassinating Galen Erso, similar to how Vel and Cinta are tasked with eliminating him in this show. It's quite consistent with RO in terms of tone, the difference being Andor with 24 episodes can go much deeper into the true cost of a rebellion and the sacrifices that have to be made.
 

ZE_501

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Mon Mothma setting her own husband up to take the fall is a move I never expected from her, but it shows that Luthen is getting in her head; everyone needs to make sacrifices for the cause.
Well...the ISB doesn't care if he's a problem gambler, they only care about weird banking moves, so he's a bold but convenient excuse. And kind of a **** so really, who can blame her? :LOL:

And her daughter.
That's been softened a bit since they illustrated her daughter reaching for a conservative Chandrilan (sp?) identity by attaching herself to old ways her own parents either ignored or eschewed ... a rebellion by a spoiled rich girl trying to make her progressive mom mad. She's not being forced but I guess it's still a cold set-up by a calculating mom.
 
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