Black Panther Wakanda Forever - November 11, 2022

[Zurdo95D]

I’ve finally watched BP: WF, and I liked it a whole bunch! I thought it was an interesting take to have CB’s passing reflected in the film’s story. (I personally would’ve liked to have him recur posthumously via motion capture/voice synthesizing, but undoubtedly it’s a difficult matter to tackle.) With that it was just a heavily emotional film and I thought it was a good progression from the first movie. Similar to the first film, I liked how it was pretty much its self-contained story.

Just as the first film, I enjoyed seeing the world of Wakanda and it’s just awesome to see the characters be part of that setting. In addition, seeing Atlantis introduced was also just so cool. For me personally it’s thrilling to see Latin American culture adapted! I thought the underwater world shown was intriguing and while not as bright/colorful as Aquaman’s underwater world, I felt it looked pretty cool while having some sense of “realism”. Of course I would’ve liked to explore more of Atlantis but perhaps we will in future films.

I liked all the characters in the movie and they all performed well, all the supporting characters were great. I liked Shuri in the first BP, and I thought she excelled in this one. I felt all her turmoil and torment, as well as mother Ramonda. I gotta say I liked seeing Shuri take on the Black Panther mantle and her entrance donning the suit was just BA. While it did happen in the comics, it’s also cool seeing that come to the big screen. I really liked how she took the initiative to become the new Black Panther. It was interesting to see her be in such a vengeful spirit and push towards aggression, since it didn’t strike me before that she would. And, she struggles with her inner self, when she meets Killmonger in the ancestral plane. (It was awesome seeing him again and I wish he‘d lived in some way to see more of his character). She struggles with her beliefs as he points out, and it seemed he was the one to meet her there because she felt so strongly about revenge on Namor. Oh man her final battle with Namor! She kicked some serious butt and it was brutal to see them go at it (as expected between two powerful combatants), she was even impaled! Namor was cool to see on the big screen, admittedly I don’t know much of the comics version but I do like this adaptation and again, I appreciate how they incorporated Latin American culture for his backstory. I wish to see more of his history (and Atlantis’); I was left wanting to explore more. I liked how he wasn’t a straight pure evil villain, but he seemed more akin to an anti-hero (as pointed out in the comics) and he had strong motivations. I did like the resolution between Wakanda and Atlantis in the battle on the ocean, when Shuri sees past her swell of revenge and makes the decision to be herself.

The score was well done; I dug it when Shuri was overlooking Atlantis and it felt so fitting. Despite it being nearly three hours long, I didn’t feel the runtime at all since I was so invested in the story. I really liked one of the premises of the two big world powers at play and it’ll be cool in the future (hopefully) to see Wakanda and Atlantis team up. It was nice to introduce T’Challa and Nakia’s son to potentially see him take the throne in the future. Overall I found it an emotional, enjoyable film and like it bunches.

 

[a-dev]

I couldn't help but wish Shuri was played by Lupita instead......

 

[Khev]

I couldn't help but wish Shuri was played by Lupita instead......

At least she wasn't wasted like she was in Star Wars. Hey let's take one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood and cast her as...Maz Kanata!

Next up Ana de Armas as Yoda's mom.

 

[The Buffinator]

At least she wasn't wasted like she was in Star Wars. Hey let's take one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood and cast her as...Maz Kanata!

Next up Ana de Armas as Yoda's mom.

Did you mean Grogu? That would explain why he's so damn cute lol...

 

[Dave_W]

At least she wasn't wasted like she was in Star Wars. Hey let's take one of the most beautiful women in Hollywood and cast her as...Maz Kanata!

Next up Ana de Armas as Yoda's mom.

Made worse by the fact she'd won an Oscar the month before TFA principle photography started.

 

[Mondragon]

LOL Namor & Nakia!

Tenoch Huerta & Lupita Nyong'o, got to love these two celebrating together.



Tiene Tumbao'

 

[Victοr]

There's quite a bit of Namuri fanart out there.

I think they're gonna run with it as the MCU's Namor/Susan. There's really no way to do that other one without a lot of contrivances, and it was always in poor taste. It made Namor look like an even bigger dick than usual, Susan came off as a whore, and Reed was humiliated. Bad plot that they always come back to because comic book writers are obsessed with soap operas. I'll be glad if it's reworked here. I still think Shuri should've been Lupita. NuShuri is trash. Hudlin destroyed the BP lore IMO, but his Shuri was pretty great. Current Shuri is just a Zoomer version of the "supergenius teen" which I've always, always loathed. Proper Shuri was a hardass.

And the design was much better. I'll never get over how bad the new Twig Panther looks...

I’ve finally watched BP: WF, and I liked it a whole bunch! I thought it was an interesting take to have CB’s passing reflected in the film’s story. (I personally would’ve liked to have him recur posthumously via motion capture/voice synthesizing, but undoubtedly it’s a difficult matter to tackle.) With that it was just a heavily emotional film and I thought it was a good progression from the first movie. Similar to the first film, I liked how it was pretty much its self-contained story.

Just as the first film, I enjoyed seeing the world of Wakanda and it’s just awesome to see the characters be part of that setting. In addition, seeing Atlantis introduced was also just so cool. For me personally it’s thrilling to see Latin American culture adapted! I thought the underwater world shown was intriguing and while not as bright/colorful as Aquaman’s underwater world, I felt it looked pretty cool while having some sense of “realism”. Of course I would’ve liked to explore more of Atlantis but perhaps we will in future films.

I liked all the characters in the movie and they all performed well, all the supporting characters were great. I liked Shuri in the first BP, and I thought she excelled in this one. I felt all her turmoil and torment, as well as mother Ramonda. I gotta say I liked seeing Shuri take on the Black Panther mantle and her entrance donning the suit was just BA. While it did happen in the comics, it’s also cool seeing that come to the big screen. I really liked how she took the initiative to become the new Black Panther. It was interesting to see her be in such a vengeful spirit and push towards aggression, since it didn’t strike me before that she would. And, she struggles with her inner self, when she meets Killmonger in the ancestral plane. (It was awesome seeing him again and I wish he‘d lived in some way to see more of his character). She struggles with her beliefs as he points out, and it seemed he was the one to meet her there because she felt so strongly about revenge on Namor. Oh man her final battle with Namor! She kicked some serious butt and it was brutal to see them go at it (as expected between two powerful combatants), she was even impaled! Namor was cool to see on the big screen, admittedly I don’t know much of the comics version but I do like this adaptation and again, I appreciate how they incorporated Latin American culture for his backstory. I wish to see more of his history (and Atlantis’); I was left wanting to explore more. I liked how he wasn’t a straight pure evil villain, but he seemed more akin to an anti-hero (as pointed out in the comics) and he had strong motivations. I did like the resolution between Wakanda and Atlantis in the battle on the ocean, when Shuri sees past her swell of revenge and makes the decision to be herself.

The score was well done; I dug it when Shuri was overlooking Atlantis and it felt so fitting. Despite it being nearly three hours long, I didn’t feel the runtime at all since I was so invested in the story. I really liked one of the premises of the two big world powers at play and it’ll be cool in the future (hopefully) to see Wakanda and Atlantis team up. It was nice to introduce T’Challa and Nakia’s son to potentially see him take the throne in the future. Overall I found it an emotional, enjoyable film and like it bunches.

It's not Atlantis. In the MCU Atlantis doesn't exist; Talocan is its own thing. Purely MesoAmerican, no connection to anything else.

And it's all that damn Aquaman's fault! And by extension Snyder's too!

 

[jye4ever]

Lupita is indeed smoking hot and her spanish is chef’s kiss lol

 

[Khev]

LOL Namor and Nakia!

Leaked footage of Namor rushing into battle in BP3:

 

[Omega9300]

There's quite a bit of Namuri fanart out there.

I think they're gonna run with it as the MCU's Namor/Susan. There's really no way to do that other one without a lot of contrivances, and it was always in poor taste. It made Namor look like an even bigger dick than usual, Susan came off as a whore, and Reed was humiliated. Bad plot that they always come back to because comic book writers are obsessed with soap operas. I'll be glad if it's reworked here. I still think Shuri should've been Lupita. NuShuri is trash. Hudlin destroyed the BP lore IMO, but his Shuri was pretty great. Current Shuri is just a Zoomer version of the "supergenius teen" which I've always, always loathed. Proper Shuri was a hardass.

And the design was much better. I'll never get over how bad the new Twig Panther looks...


It's not Atlantis. In the MCU Atlantis doesn't exist; Talocan is its own thing. Purely MesoAmerican, no connection to anything else.

And it's all that damn Aquaman's fault! And by extension Snyder's too!

Yeah as you bring this up it reminds me how when I was a kid in the 70’s and reading Fantastic Four comics thinking like WTF is up with Namor and Sue and WTF is Reed’s deal, it all seemed very …awkward

 

[Mondragon]

It's a fascinating and difficult choice for her.

 

[Victοr]

Yeah as you bring this up it reminds me how when I was a kid in the 70’s and reading Fantastic Four comics thinking like WTF is up with Namor and Sue and WTF is Reed’s deal, it all seemed very …awkward

It was always very weird. It was a remnant of Namor's early romances with "surface dweller" women, but the more it went on the more disgusting the whole thing became. The deal with Susan and Namor being a bipolar hypocrite are my main gripes against the character, and why I flip-flop so much on whether I like him or I hate him. Same with most of the X-Men nowadays, really... When Namor is the token jock that is an annoying, but enjoyable, arse, who delivers a piece of wisdom in the end, he works. When he's a troubled King trying to rule his people and keep them from going forward with surface dweller genocide, he, again, works. But there are times when he's an absolutely dreadful person and for that reason I get why people hate him.

He chases a married woman, time and time again, which at the end makes him come off as pathetic and nothing more. His whole "anti-hero" status stems from protecting Atlantis from the "evil surface dwellers". Old FF issues had some soap-boxing about how "(the white American) man's world" is full of strife and racism/hate/etc, and that's why he's against it because... somehow that means the "surface dwellers" will come for Atlantis. Then you remember that all Atlanteans are the same shade of blue with the same characteristics, and no matter what origin/retcon you follow, all belong to a single "country". So how did the "enlightened Atlanteans" manage to "overcome" all those negative qualities of man when they never had to face them? It's like a guy from a secluded village in Iceland going to India and lecturing them about how they're not getting along across the entire country. It's honestly ridiculous, but that's always been Namor's "thing". He's mixed and Atlanteans shun him, but he claims Atlantis is above petty squabbles, he chastises humans for being war-like, but Atlantis is close to launching a new tsunami every other weekend, and so on. He's either inherently inconsistent and thus annoying, or writers can't decide what he is, which makes him a poor character and Atlantis a bunch of wackjobs. I'll be honest, much as I like Ancient Aliens/Advanced Ancients, neither the Atlanteans nor the Inhumans (or the Eternals) much appealed to me. They were half-baked ideas always, but it just so happened that Namor and Black Bolt were cool.

All in all, there's no rhyme or reason to it, and Marvel Atlantis, beyond the basic aesthetics, has nothing to do with the IRL myth, or any other interpretation of it. Marvel Atlanteans have no great tech and the whole point that they were drowned because of hubris is never brought up. Instead they're just another Marvel take on "alien/mutant/etc thing is morally superior to basic humans, who suck, and also somethingsomethingracismmetaphorsomethingsomething". It's why Namor's never had much of a solo, because his lore is convoluted (there's about 4 or 5 different origins for Marvel Atlantis, one of them involving the Biblical Flood and Ikaris from the Eternals creating Noah's Ark...) and he has no aims. At best he's an eco-warrior, but that's a side-characteristic; you need more. Namor's entertaining as a singular character, nothing else about him works in any way. He's never been a good King, his "kingdom" is a mess, he only gets off scot free on the atrocities he commits by his seniority. He's like a guy with cheat codes activated.

Basically Namor is only enjoyable as the jock of the group who has the balls to do what needs to be done. His backstory, motivations and everything else, range from flimsy to moronic. Because he is canonically kind of bipolar, and also a bit of a hypocrite, his "cool jock" image is dragged down by everything else he does when he's not being a cool jock. From the botched alliances to the eternal Susan chasing. Basically Namor's whole usefulness to the entire universe is to be the cool jock and that's it. It makes him entertaining when used properly, but I can't say that he's a massively useful character. He is still around because he's Marvel's first character, and he brings a different perspective to the table, but when you look at the facts only, I can't honestly say that anything would change if he never existed. Well, that's wrong. Technically Namor's Tsunami that begun the "Marvel Age" coupled with Magneto's attacks are basically the reason why the MU is so much more paranoid about supers, but that's another talk.

So, what I will say about the film version, is that streamlining "Namor" into an Indigenous American who has specific grievances, does work better than comic Namor's vague, X-Men like, persecution-complex. It makes him a more consistent character, it does away with "analogues" and it tackles something real. Of course it's still watered down/oversimplified, but that's to be expected from a capeflick. In a 3-hour movie, it's ridiculous that all we got about "Namor" was a flasback to 10 people hanging around a jungle and then going underwater, somehow resulting in them/Namor magically building a goddamn sun under there in 400 years. We needed more about Talocan, but what can you do. Maybe in a spin-off.

Anyway, point is, the MCU version, from a certain point of view, did create a more well-rounded character. There's a baseline, there's an edge, it all comes together instead of pointing at different directions, so to speak. But he's not the same character, he's someone "similar". Me, I'd have done something different, as I've mentioned before. Go with an Ultimate/Nadia route. Proto-Egyptians/Babylonians/etc, hubris leading to their downfall, stuff like that. As it stands, on its own merits, I like the new version as an AU. Will I buy a dolly? I'll probably hold off for the time being and wait, see what he gets up to later. I don't like the guy playing Kang, but when I put the Kang dolly on my shelf I'll always see Kang, you know? This new Namor is too tied to a specific culture and origin for me to reconcile him with the comic version. So I'm torn on it and would rather wait a bit. But I am rooting for a solo flick, either way.

 

[Omega9300]

It was always very weird. It was a remnant of Namor's early romances with "surface dweller" women, but the more it went on the more disgusting the whole thing became. The deal with Susan and Namor being a bipolar hypocrite are my main gripes against the character, and why I flip-flop so much on whether I like him or I hate him. Same with most of the X-Men nowadays, really... When Namor is the token jock that is an annoying, but enjoyable, arse, who delivers a piece of wisdom in the end, he works. When he's a troubled King trying to rule his people and keep them from going forward with surface dweller genocide, he, again, works. But there are times when he's an absolutely dreadful person and for that reason I get why people hate him.

He chases a married woman, time and time again, which at the end makes him come off as pathetic and nothing more. His whole "anti-hero" status stems from protecting Atlantis from the "evil surface dwellers". Old FF issues had some soap-boxing about how "(the white American) man's world" is full of strife and racism/hate/etc, and that's why he's against it because... somehow that means the "surface dwellers" will come for Atlantis. Then you remember that all Atlanteans are the same shade of blue with the same characteristics, and no matter what origin/retcon you follow, all belong to a single "country". So how did the "enlightened Atlanteans" manage to "overcome" all those negative qualities of man when they never had to face them? It's like a guy from a secluded village in Iceland going to India and lecturing them about how they're not getting along across the entire country. It's honestly ridiculous, but that's always been Namor's "thing". He's mixed and Atlanteans shun him, but he claims Atlantis is above petty squabbles, he chastises humans for being war-like, but Atlantis is close to launching a new tsunami every other weekend, and so on. He's either inherently inconsistent and thus annoying, or writers can't decide what he is, which makes him a poor character and Atlantis a bunch of wackjobs. I'll be honest, much as I like Ancient Aliens/Advanced Ancients, neither the Atlanteans nor the Inhumans (or the Eternals) much appealed to me. They were half-baked ideas always, but it just so happened that Namor and Black Bolt were cool.

All in all, there's no rhyme or reason to it, and Marvel Atlantis, beyond the basic aesthetics, has nothing to do with the IRL myth, or any other interpretation of it. Marvel Atlanteans have no great tech and the whole point that they were drowned because of hubris is never brought up. Instead they're just another Marvel take on "alien/mutant/etc thing is morally superior to basic humans, who suck, and also somethingsomethingracismmetaphorsomethingsomething". It's why Namor's never had much of a solo, because his lore is convoluted (there's about 4 or 5 different origins for Marvel Atlantis, one of them involving the Biblical Flood and Ikaris from the Eternals creating Noah's Ark...) and he has no aims. At best he's an eco-warrior, but that's a side-characteristic; you need more. Namor's entertaining as a singular character, nothing else about him works in any way. He's never been a good King, his "kingdom" is a mess, he only gets off scot free on the atrocities he commits by his seniority. He's like a guy with cheat codes activated.

Basically Namor is only enjoyable as the jock of the group who has the balls to do what needs to be done. His backstory, motivations and everything else, range from flimsy to moronic. Because he is canonically kind of bipolar, and also a bit of a hypocrite, his "cool jock" image is dragged down by everything else he does when he's not being a cool jock. From the botched alliances to the eternal Susan chasing. Basically Namor's whole usefulness to the entire universe is to be the cool jock and that's it. It makes him entertaining when used properly, but I can't say that he's a massively useful character. He is still around because he's Marvel's first character, and he brings a different perspective to the table, but when you look at the facts only, I can't honestly say that anything would change if he never existed. Well, that's wrong. Technically Namor's Tsunami that begun the "Marvel Age" coupled with Magneto's attacks are basically the reason why the MU is so much more paranoid about supers, but that's another talk.

So, what I will say about the film version, is that streamlining "Namor" into an Indigenous American who has specific grievances, does work better than comic Namor's vague, X-Men like, persecution-complex. It makes him a more consistent character, it does away with "analogues" and it tackles something real. Of course it's still watered down/oversimplified, but that's to be expected from a capeflick. In a 3-hour movie, it's ridiculous that all we got about "Namor" was a flasback to 10 people hanging around a jungle and then going underwater, somehow resulting in them/Namor magically building a goddamn sun under there in 400 years. We needed more about Talocan, but what can you do. Maybe in a spin-off.

Anyway, point is, the MCU version, from a certain point of view, did create a more well-rounded character. There's a baseline, there's an edge, it all comes together instead of pointing at different directions, so to speak. But he's not the same character, he's someone "similar". Me, I'd have done something different, as I've mentioned before. Go with an Ultimate/Nadia route. Proto-Egyptians/Babylonians/etc, hubris leading to their downfall, stuff like that. As it stands, on its own merits, I like the new version as an AU. Will I buy a dolly? I'll probably hold off for the time being and wait, see what he gets up to later. I don't like the guy playing Kang, but when I put the Kang dolly on my shelf I'll always see Kang, you know? This new Namor is too tied to a specific culture and origin for me to reconcile him with the comic version. So I'm torn on it and would rather wait a bit. But I am rooting for a solo flick, either way.

Yeah the whole Namor and Susan thing with Reed as a bit of a Cuckold was always really strange and it is a bit surprising that different writers apparently sort of kept that whole thing up for a while is puzzling, then again it makes sense from the perspective you suggest regarding that storyline adding “soap opera drama” …regardless it does make Namor come off like a dick and simultaneously make Reed look bad.

Until reading your reply above I never really thought about the hypocrisy/inconsistencies in Namor as a character. Of course we as people are not always consistent in our thoughts or behaviors but it certainly helps bring clarity when a character’s basic motivations and way of doing things line up.

I liked the way Namor in Wakanda Forever had specific, coh

 

[choombaz]

It was the times man. Read any comic from that era and you’ll get the same weird stuff.


Namor and Nakia sittin’ in a tree ….

 

[jedibear]

I’ve finally watched BP: WF, and I liked it a whole bunch!

I am sincerely pleased you enjoyed this so much, Zurdo. I know I've had my fair share of movies over the years that I enjoyed the heck out of and wondered why more folks didn't feel the same. Always a great feeling when the emotion comes across in a movie and and really lands for you.

This one will go down as one of those moments for me that are happening more with movies and shows in general where I watch it after reading and/or hearing the praise and am just left stumped. I would have loved to see the movie the way you described. But no, that wasn't the "Wakanda Forever" movie I tried to sit through. Not by a long shot.

I still enjoy watching the first Black Panther a lot and in thinking about it, the main thing that pulls me into it right to the end every time is the presence and natural charisma of Chadwick Bozeman. Like Downy in the first Iron Man and Evans in the first two Captain America films, Boseman just embodies the character so completely and just commands the movie.

All other issues I may have with Wakanda Forever aside, the one the rises to the forefront is the complete lack of center - there is no character that grabs the viewer and propels you through the story. No offense to Ms. Wright, but she just doesn't have the chops to support the weight of this movie or the mantle of the character.

I won't go on and harp on every detail that distracted and made this unwatchable to me. I'm just amazed and a little sad that the MCU has turned into something almost faceless and mechanical. I'll always watch those first few films of this franchise and enjoy them.

I'm glad there are folks who accept this movie and the other recent offerings from Marvel and enjoy them for what they are.

Keep the fire burning, Zurdo!

 

[Dave_W]

LOL Namor & Nakia!

Tenoch Huerta & Lupita Nyong'o, got to love these two celebrating together.



Tiene Tumbao'

BF3 final battle scene...

 

[Zurdo95D]

I am sincerely pleased you enjoyed this so much, Zurdo. I know I've had my fair share of movies over the years that I enjoyed the heck out of and wondered why more folks didn't feel the same. Always a great feeling when the emotion comes across in a movie and and really lands for you.

This one will go down as one of those moments for me that are happening more with movies and shows in general where I watch it after reading and/or hearing the praise and am just left stumped. I would have loved to see the movie the way you described. But no, that wasn't the "Wakanda Forever" movie I tried to sit through. Not by a long shot.

I still enjoy watching the first Black Panther a lot and in thinking about it, the main thing that pulls me into it right to the end every time is the presence and natural charisma of Chadwick Bozeman. Like Downy in the first Iron Man and Evans in the first two Captain America films, Boseman just embodies the character so completely and just commands the movie.

All other issues I may have with Wakanda Forever aside, the one the rises to the forefront is the complete lack of center - there is no character that grabs the viewer and propels you through the story. No offense to Ms. Wright, but she just doesn't have the chops to support the weight of this movie or the mantle of the character.

Agreed! CB brought a gravitas to the character, and, was so compelling in the role I felt. Nevertheless, while LW didn't match CB's T'C/BP, I still throughly enjoyed seeing her as Shuri and being one of the protagonists.

I won't go on and harp on every detail that distracted and made this unwatchable to me. I'm just amazed and a little sad that the MCU has turned into something almost faceless and mechanical. I'll always watch those first few films of this franchise and enjoy them.

Reading through the thread I do note and concur with some of the qualms with the film, and I thought of listing them, but for me I opt not to do so much of that because I like to simply focus on the stuff I am fascinated with (the positives ).

I tend to agree that, yes, currently it seems they're putting out content at such a quick pace! So many shows and movies to keep up with; what I do is just, as with collecting, cherry pick what I watch. (I tend to watch mainly what I'm intrigued by.)

I'm glad there are folks who accept this movie and the other recent offerings from Marvel and enjoy them for what they are.

Keep the fire burning, Zurdo!

 

[Zurdo95D]

[...]

It's not Atlantis. In the MCU Atlantis doesn't exist; Talocan is its own thing. Purely MesoAmerican, no connection to anything else.

And it's all that damn Aquaman's fault! And by extension Snyder's too!

I know, I know Despite the movie telling us it's Talocan I can't help but think it's Atlantis

 

[Victοr]

Yeah the whole Namor and Susan thing with Reed as a bit of a Cuckold was always really strange and it is a bit surprising that different writers apparently sort of kept that whole thing up for a while is puzzling, then again it makes sense from the perspective you suggest regarding that storyline adding “soap opera drama” …regardless it does make Namor come off like a dick and simultaneously make Reed look bad.

Until reading your reply above I never really thought about the hypocrisy/inconsistencies in Namor as a character. Of course we as people are not always consistent in our thoughts or behaviors but it certainly helps bring clarity when a character’s basic motivations and way of doing things line up.

I liked the way Namor in Wakanda Forever had specific, coh

Sometimes hypocritical qualities can work in that they make a character a bit more "real". But at some point it stops being an instance or two of personal failure, and it turns into inconsistent writing and a poor character. Why does the world's smartest man keep tolerating a maniac trying to steal his wife? Why does said wife keep feeding his obsession? Why is a supergenius mage teaming up with the equivalent of a flying brick? Why do the governments of the world keep tolerating a foreign, undersea body, that tries to commit genocide of the surface every 2 years? Why does Cap still vouch for him? Why did the Illuminati even add him to the group? Before the drowning the Atlanteans were normal humans, why are they acting as if they came from Mars? Well, there's the origin that has them be literal mermen who just found the Atlantean wreck making them squatters and appropriators of a literal dead culture, so... The whole thing is "straight up ******", to speak plainly.

The fact is that Namor as a character coasts by on his seniority and established ties, while sort of dragging down the rest of the MU. It's kind of similar with the X-Men and their eternal persecution complex, when it makes no sense and the "mutant experience" is frankly insulting to the real world. Namor keeps doing whatever the Hell he wants and suffers no repercussions because he's the eternal arse who has to be there to be smarmy. His saving grace is that he's such an arrogant bastard that he can commit atrocities when needed and act as a scapegoat. The truth is, in Marvel-land, if you have some made up reason to be mad at "the man", then writers there will find a way to excuse your behaviour no matter what. Well, even if it's hacky I still find it more interesting than DC's circus strongmen who've remained unchanged and trite since the 30s.

So what is it that makes Namor different to other loved bastards of the MU, like Magneto or Doom? The "have my cake and eat it too" attitude I'd say. Magneto is a card-carrying mutant supremacist. Even if the X-Men accepted him because for the last ~10 years the X-Men have been bonkers, he's not being anything but his usual self. He's not hanging out with Cap and the Avengers or being invited to the house of the man he tries to cuck. Same with Doom. He's a card-carrying villain, and even then he's less of an immediate threat than Namor. He mostly screws with Reed, has black ops do his dirty work, and is always after some cosmic McGuffin, he's not flooding New York every Saturday. Even then, his relationship with the FF is such that he's on the stand-by due to Valeria. Both Magneto and Doom are arses, but they're consistent in their portrayal. Their sins are not just brushed off. Meanwhile Namor can do whatever he wants and suffer no repercussions.

In the end, even as a self-proclaimed Namorfan, when I do scratch beneath the surface of the arrogant jock I enjoy, he actually does piss me off. It's the same exact thing with the X-Men, but with one notable difference; the X-Men became that insufferable around the late 00s. I still have tons upon tons of stories to look back on and have nostalgia for them. Namor's always been that kind of a hypocritical arse, although mostly an enjoyable one. And while the X-Men have all the lore, the great costumes and stories, Namor doesn't. And at this point I'm wondering why do I even like the character, if what I like in actuality is my personal idea of him. But in a way that's true for most capecharacters. I suppose it's because I'm a Doomfan and Namor used to be his most frequent ally, so in a sort of "transitive relation" way, I developed an affinity for Namor too. Which is silly when you think about it... Oh bugger I don't know, this whole thing is more hassle than it's worth, I'll tell you that. I wish I liked 10 characters in total and 5 IPs so that I could buy 20 dollies and be done with it...

It was the times man. Read any comic from that era and you’ll get the same weird stuff.


Namor and Nakia sittin’ in a tree ….

The Namor/Susan thing is specifically weird because it requires so many components to work. Reed needs to be a spineless cuck who can't just shoot Namor, Susan needs to be a literal whore, and Namor needs to be a horny moron akin to a caveman. It goes beyond soap opera love triangles and with it running for so long, it legitimately taints all the characters involved.

I know, I know Despite the movie telling us it's Talocan I can't help but think it's Atlantis

Oh, my bad then. I figured you thought that they were doing Atlantis just under a different name. There was speculation/rumors in the beginning that they'd go with the Lost Isle Of Mu as the explanation for Atlantis in the MU, so my mind went there.

 

[Mondragon]

BF3 final battle scene...

True^ final should have been a Dance Battle:
Sharks vs Jets Panthers