The Lord of the Rings: The Rings of Power | Amazon Prime Video - September 2, 2022

Kebron said:

For some, not all. For me it took till Ned Stark’s final episode to make me start liking GoT, that’s further then 4 episodes to get me caring about GoT.

Babylon5, Most Star Treks, BSG, Highlander, etc all have slow or horrible first seasons or first several episodes. They go on to build into a great series. Everyone is different with what hooks them but to write a show off after a handful of episodes seems a bit premature. To proclaim it “horrible” “the worst ever” is definitely disingenuous.

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Fair enough

That's a good point, the first season of ST:TNG was not great, but I was a kid and I was into it. It got much better, much later. Even my beloved Expanse was a little hard to get into for the first season.

I'm aware I have less patience now ... ... but I do remember saying this show is probably more appealing to a younger audience at the moment. (Or a more forgiving one).

ZE_501 said:

That's a good point, the first season of ST:TNG was not great, but I was a kid and I was into it. It got much better, much later. Even my beloved Expanse was a little hard to get into for the first season.

I'm aware I have less patience now ... ... but I do remember saying this show is probably more appealing to a younger audience at the moment. (Or a more forgiving one).

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I think less patience is something that affects everyone. There’s a lot of content we all want to watch so there’s pressure on the show runners to grab our attention quick. IMO that’s why a lot of the shows today just aren’t as good because they try to rush the ground work. And even when they are good and get our attention they are mostly forgettable and lack rewatchability because they don’t have a lot of depth. Black Sails, GoT and Expanse are the only recent shows I can think of that I could or have already rewatch. I rewatch Black Sails yearly. That show is always amazing IMO.

Black Sails was terrific. I've watched it twice. I also loved Spartacus.

The Terminal List was great. The Old Man is pretty damn good too. And the series Reacher was pretty good. All those shows grab you pretty much immediately.

Kebron said:

I think less patience is something that affects everyone. There’s a lot of content we all want to watch so there’s pressure on the show runners to grab our attention quick. IMO that’s why a lot of the shows today just aren’t as good because they try to rush the ground work. And even when they are good and get our attention they are mostly forgettable and lack rewatchability because they don’t have a lot of depth. Black Sails, GoT and Expanse are the only recent shows I can think of that I could or have already rewatch. I rewatch Black Sails yearly. That show is always amazing IMO.

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Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power Was Handed To Two Unproven Showrunners. Here's Why - Looper

Rings Of Power is the most expensive TV show ever. Some estimates say the out the door cost is something like 60 million an episode for the first season, if you break it all down.

The high expectations come with the price tag.

With that much money, Bezos is out of excuses. You can't say we couldn't afford more CGI or not enough to pay this certain actor we wanted or we couldn't appeal to a great script writer, etc, etc. Bezos could just back up a truck full of cash and gotten the best directors, writers, set designers, etc, etc in the entire business. You have great scripts and tons of exposure, you'll draw in great actors.

The show is halfway through the first season and there is no forward progression.

Apple TV spent 200 million on the first season of Invasion. Which was really not about aliens but endless interpersonal drama. The only reason the show survived to a 2nd season in production is Apple is willing to double down on the mistake. Invasion was boring. It was just bad storytelling. I could have done that for Apple for 20 bucks. Given them boring for close to free.

Amazon picked two showrunners with close to no experience to helm Rings Of Power. Again, the most expensive TV show ever made.

How about the simple answer? Two people were picked whom are clearly in over their heads and Bezos is probably using the show as a type of money laundering scheme.

The job description was to deliver a hit TV show that surpassed all expectations. Instead what's given is excuses and blaming fans.

Bezos put this show into a zero margin of error type of situation, and that's exactly what he got.

a-dev said:

Black Sails was terrific. I've watched it twice. I also loved Spartacus.

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I forgot about Spartacus. Not cause it’s bad. I really liked it, but because I just forgot. To much stuff I’ve watched since then.

GordonGekko said:

Lord Of The Rings: The Rings Of Power Was Handed To Two Unproven Showrunners. Here's Why - Looper

Rings Of Power is the most expensive TV show ever. Some estimates say the out the door cost is something like 60 million an episode for the first season, if you break it all down.

The high expectations come with the price tag.

With that much money, Bezos is out of excuses. You can't say we couldn't afford more CGI or not enough to pay this certain actor we wanted or we couldn't appeal to a great script writer, etc, etc. Bezos could just back up a truck full of cash and gotten the best directors, writers, set designers, etc, etc in the entire business. You have great scripts and tons of exposure, you'll draw in great actors.

The show is halfway through the first season and there is no forward progression.

Apple TV spent 200 million on the first season of Invasion. Which was really not about aliens but endless interpersonal drama. The only reason the show survived to a 2nd season in production is Apple is willing to double down on the mistake. Invasion was boring. It was just bad storytelling. I could have done that for Apple for 20 bucks. Given them boring for close to free.

Amazon picked two showrunners with close to no experience to helm Rings Of Power. Again, the most expensive TV show ever made.

How about the simple answer? Two people were picked whom are clearly in over their heads and Bezos is probably using the show as a type of money laundering scheme.

The job description was to deliver a hit TV show that surpassed all expectations. Instead what's given is excuses and blaming fans.

Bezos put this show into a zero margin of error type of situation, and that's exactly what he got.

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But there has been forward progression every episode. It’s in the dialog.

As for the price tag. My understanding is that a big chunk of that was just to get the rights to do it.

I’m not sure what you point of Invasion was with the rest of what you said.

As for the rest we are just differing in opinions. I don’t find the CGI bad and I don’t think the show runners are over there head, so far IMO they are doing a good job.

Bezos has put out a pretty good show IMO

Elrond and Durin story (which admittedly remains the highlight due to the excellent performances for me) kinda sums up the writing so far.

Plot introduction: Durin ultimately decides to trust Elrond, but suspects there's more to his arrival. Durin is torn between this friendship and duty to his father and kingdom.

End of last episode: Durin ultimately decides to trust Elrond, but suspects there's more to his arrival. Durin is torn between this friendship and duty to his father and kingdom.

Oh yeah memba mithril

ArtDamage said:

Elrond and Durin story (which admittedly remains the highlight due to the excellent performances for me) kinda sums up the writing so far.

Plot introduction: Durin ultimately decides to trust Elrond, but suspects there's more to his arrival. Durin is torn between this friendship and duty to his father and kingdom.

End of last episode: Durin ultimately decides to trust Elrond, but suspects there's more to his arrival. Durin is torn between this friendship and duty to his father and kingdom.

Oh yeah memba mithril

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You can sum up most shows in the same way. House of Dragon Introduction Brother covets brothers power, Daughter is worried she will be supplanted as heir, King is worried he’s doing a bad job. End of episode same as the beginning. Every episode so far has started the same and ended the same. What is missing just like in your example is the details showing the character and story progress. Elrond arrived to get the dwarves help in building the tower after a challenge and reforging a friendship he gets that help. The dwarves discovered a mystery item in their mines. It’s revealed to be mithril. The king suspects there is something more going on with the elves request, he dispatched his son to discover it.

Progress is there if you really want to see it.

Kebron said:

You can sum up most shows in the same way. House of Dragon Introduction Brother covets brothers power, Daughter is worried she will be supplanted as heir, King is worried he’s doing a bad job. End of episode same as the beginning. Every episode so far has started the same and ended the same. What is missing just like in your example is the details showing the character and story progress. Elrond arrived to get the dwarves help in building the tower after a challenge and reforging a friendship he gets that help. The dwarves discovered a mystery item in their mines. It’s revealed to be mithril. The king suspects there is something more going on with the elves request, he dispatched his son to discover it.

Progress is there if you really want to see it.

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Eh not quite and you basically said the same thing I did about Elrond/Durin you just used more words

For example:

Rhaenyra-
1)begins her arc certain that she doesn't mean much to her father as she's not the son he wanted.

2) Loses her mother and is faced with not only the betrayal of her best friend set in motion by the kings hand, but the fact that the marriage will undermine her place further.

3) reissured by her father by being named heir. She gets want she wants, but at a price. Now she is faced with the dilemma of finding a suitor to strengthen her position and further the targaryen line. She rebels against though she does want her place as Queen.

4) Eventually sees her position from a political perspective. Accepts that she has a responsibility to the realm and to her father, but begins to dig into the double life of people in power.

Her character has gone through big personal changes and development in just a few episodes. We started with a Rhaenyra uncertain of her future as heir to a Rhaenyra that's begun to mature into her role in the court.

Compared to...

Galadriel:
Doesnt want to go to Valinor because she wants revenge on Sauron. Maintains anger on the sail to Numenor where she can rage at the queen.
Asks a little nicer the 2nd time and gains their cooperation. Something we all knew was happening since she arrived. Still looking for Sauron.

No real changes to character. Maybe she's ever so slightly more diplomatic than she arrived? Future will tell I guess.

Nah I'm sorry man I don't see it. That's what I mean about spinning its wheels. Her situation hasn't really changed and the show his half over. I'm still not sure why I should care about her other than the fact that she's Galadriel and I know she's important in later more interesting stories.


You enjoy it, more (rings of, heh) power to ya.
For me, either they're purposefully padding for time since they want 12 seasons or whatever out of this or the writing team is a huge let down. I'm not sure what's worse.

But no more ranting from me. Back to finishing Better Call Saul.

ArtDamage said:

Eh not quite and you basically said the same thing I did about Elrond/Durin you just used more words

For example:

Rhaenyra-
1)begins her arc certain that she doesn't mean much to her father as she's not the son he wanted.

2) Loses her mother and is faced with not only the betrayal of her best friend set in motion by the kings hand, but the fact that the marriage will undermine her place further.

3) reissured by her father by being named heir. She gets want she wants, but at a price. Now she is faced with the dilemma of finding a suitor to strengthen her position and further the targaryen line. She rebels against though she does want her place as Queen.

4) Eventually sees her position from a political perspective. Accepts that she has a responsibility to the realm and to her father, but begins to dig into the double life of people in power.

Her character has gone through big personal changes and development in just a few episodes. We started with a Rhaenyra uncertain of her future as heir to a Rhaenyra that's begun to mature into her role in the court.

Compared to...

Galadriel:
Doesnt want to go to Valinor because she wants revenge on Sauron. Maintains anger on the sail to Numenor where she can rage at the queen.
Asks a little nicer the 2nd time and gains their cooperation. Something we all knew was happening since she arrived. Still looking for Sauron.

No real changes to character. Maybe she's ever so slightly more diplomatic than she arrived? Future will tell I guess.

Nah I'm sorry man I don't see it. That's what I mean about spinning its wheels. Her situation hasn't really changed and the show his half over. I'm still not sure why I should care about her other than the fact that she's Galadriel and I know she's important in later more interesting stories.


You enjoy it, more (rings of, heh) power to ya.
For me, either they're purposefully padding for time since they want 12 seasons or whatever out of this or the writing team is a huge let down. I'm not sure what's worse.

But no more ranting from me. Back to finishing Better Call Saul.

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You basically added the detail for House of Dragon I said you left out for Rings of Power. She still is worried her father will supplant her as heir. I can give a detailed breakdown of forward character movement in Rings of Power for you if you’d like by Insuspect you wouldn’t care.

Both shows have forward momentum your opinions keep you from seeing that even if it’s explained to you.

Am I the only one who can't stand Galadriel? I just despise her every time she's on screen with that bitchy rude attitude of hers. A terribly written one-dimensional character. People keep telling me her character will change by the end of the show, but isn't she like 5000 years old here? If you haven't developed a personality in 5000 years then what difference will another 5 make?

Other than that I'm still enjoying the show and will stick by it. Sure it's a bit slow-paced but I feel it will pay-off in the end... hopefully.

First just let me accept that Hulk smash was used in LOTR lol

Can’t expect a change in personality in a few days when you have not changed in several thousands of years. She isn’t very diplomatic for being of royalty and having to use diplomacy for thousands of years. You can say, “She is developing!” If you haven’t developed in that long of a span what is a few more thousands of years?

Slow is the new fast -- see Andor and RoP.

Captain_Trips said:

Am I the only one who can't stand Galadriel? I just despise her every time she's on screen with that bitchy rude attitude of hers. A terribly written one-dimensional character. People keep telling me her character will change by the end of the show, but isn't she like 5000 years old here? If you haven't developed a personality in 5000 years then what difference will another 5 make?

Other than that I'm still enjoying the show and will stick by it. Sure it's a bit slow-paced but I feel it will pay-off in the end... hopefully.

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Isn't 5000 years like an hour to an elf?

Captain_Trips said:

Am I the only one who can't stand Galadriel? I just despise her every time she's on screen with that bitchy rude attitude of hers. A terribly written one-dimensional character. People keep telling me her character will change by the end of the show, but isn't she like 5000 years old here? If you haven't developed a personality in 5000 years then what difference will another 5 make?

Other than that I'm still enjoying the show and will stick by it. Sure it's a bit slow-paced but I feel it will pay-off in the end... hopefully.

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Mostly since I don't really care, it's like vegging on fan fiction, IMO seems like every man in Middle Earth needs to be nagged by a woman. And I'm not some woman hater and all that. It just felt like every few minutes some poor slob was getting nagged at.

Which kinda happened in the Jackson films, but not so much. I mean Thorin & co. managed to hike North and only got nagged by Gandalf, and then there was Aragon having Arwen telling him to buck up, it'll all be OK, but it's like in the Second Age no man can find their pants by themselves. And why if you are holed up someplace, and your enemy is coming from one direction, and everyone's been sitting around eating grass or whatever, don't you just run off out the back door?

And of course Galadriel is awesome, surprised she didn't leap into the air and gently float to earth.

This show is like sitting around watching the pretty colors while simultaneously trying to decide between nachos or pizza for a snack.

Watching today's episode and just got taken *right out of it* ... a training exercise with *live steel* that degenerates into a mob, and no one got hurt? It's so ridiculous, even by fantasy standards.

I can buy Galadriel's skill given her preternatural race and age, but the whole set-up and sparring session I found ridiculous, right down to the promotion to a leadership position based on ... one barely lucky strike after presumably being "killed" 25 times?

Who writes this stuff?

Holy crap Victor was right this has to be the worst armor I’ve ever seen in a medieval show B sword and sorcery movies from the 80s had better armor I swear those guys from Numenor were wearing pajamas as armor lol

Those helmets were straight from Party City!

I did love the song that the orcs were singing during their march now that was very good LOTR!

But that armor