Thanks guys.
After some consideration I think I may be willing to let go of my long-held objection in principle to Anakin killing the younglings and instead adopt Khev's previously stated position that he didn't like it either but only because it would have been much cooler to see Anakin easily taking apart adult Jedi to show him being this prodigy he was supposed to be.
I had been viewing the killing of the younglings from a perspective that in real life we don't forgive killers of children and we don't see - or care to see - any redemption for such people. I'm inclined to think that evil is generated from within us as individuals. We can blame whatever we want but ultimately it comes down to our own character, morals and choices.
However with Star Wars, we have the Force. The Force is said to be generated by all living things but - it seems to me, that means it exists externally and it influences back upon those living things. It has a good side and a dark side and it sort of amorally offers up both to the force-sensitives. Anakin allows the dark side in and in reaction to anything that doesn't go his way he allows it to take over rather than pushing back against it as he was supposed to. His culpability can be seen to be that one choice but his evil deeds themselves are the dark side (Vader) in action. It doesn't deprive him of awareness (at least not early on), Anakin knows what it has made him do (hence the tears) and perhaps his further culpability is when he could have used his feelings of guilt to motivate him to cast the dark side out - but circumstances, the influence of Palpatine and the things he wants to achieve (attain the power to save Padme from death) mean he continues to put up no fight against the dark and it (the Sith persona Vader) ultimately consumes him (almost) completely. Vader killed the younglings. Anakin failed to stop him.
What do you think? Am I getting what you guys were saying or have I just made up a bunch of unrelated gobbledygook?
No that's very good. I accept.
From my perspective, you nailed it with respect to the Force amorally offering light and dark in equal measure. Both sides are part of the natural balance of the SW reality and can guide/compel a user of the Force to follow one path or the other.
We have two sequences in the OT that speak to this when you combine them. The first is in ANH when Luke asks Obi-Wan:
"You mean it controls your actions?" Kenobi's response (often overlooked by fans, IMO) is:
"Partially. But it also obeys your commands." The second sequence is in ROTJ when Vader says,
"It is too late for me, son. The Emperor will show you the true nature of the Force."
In both of those exchanges, there's more than just an implied suggestion that the Force (both light side and dark side) compels the user to some extent, and that this is part of its nature. Vader had earlier told Luke in the same ROTJ scene that,
"Obi-Wan once thought as you do. You don't know the power of the dark side." He seems to be referring to "power" in terms of influence/grip, and that's why he must obey Palpatine. That's how I took it, at least.
Where I find it hard to be convinced of Vader's absolution is the fact that he *did* break free to save his son. If he could make the Force obey his commands to reject Palpatine's influence in that moment, then he certainly could've done it earlier, before 20 years of being consumed by the dark.
Luke sensing Vader's inner conflict means that some part of him wants to reject the dark side in favor of the light but he just can't overcome the compulsion. I don't know if it's enough to absolve him of his evil behavior, but some measure of being "under the influence" and consumed by it makes him pitiable, if nothing else.
As for the other post, and accepting the Yoda/Kenobi interpretation, I gotta say:
I fully acknowledge that it requires more than a little mental gymnastics, but the only alternative is accepting Yoda contradicting himself in a major way, accepting that Yoda would have no ability whatsoever to foresee the potential for Luke to turn Vader, and accepting that the two old masters waited 20 years to start guiding a son to kill his father (when either one of them could've accomplished that themselves). All the while, never accounting for how to resolve the much bigger threat of Palpatine in this plan? No thanks.
Fantastic post, that's definitely how I see it.
Nick Gillard back for some actual decent fight choreography. I was so disappointed with how clunky the fight looked compared to the PT/TCW fights which are so visually impressive. Not to mention the boring, ugly setting they chose! Of all the incredible planets and visuals we’ve seen in SW media, why are we seeing “the rematch of the century” on a grey, lifeless moon at night?!
